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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Davyalabama]
#4293516
03/01/25 12:19 PM
03/01/25 12:19 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923 colbert county
cartervj
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923
colbert county
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This is trying to save the smaller pharmacies, the larger pharmacies are already getting theirs. The larger pharmacies have a greater voice, thus, they have a better return rate on the prescriptions. The smaller guys just want to make the investment the same.
Next time you go to the doctor and a friend goes that has a different insurance but having the same thing done. Look at the Eob for each of you. You will see what the doctor charged and what the provider actually paid. Why do you think some doctors have quit taking medicare or medicaid patients, the reimbursement isn't worth it to them.
Small pharmacies don't really have that luxury, same as why small hospitals and doctors offices are closing, they can't keep the lights on because of the reimbursement. Medicare and Medicaid reimbursements have been very low in the shoals and one reason we lost doctors they the years. I think it is better now. Most health care providers have teamed up to split the cost and others have went under the umbrella of the hospital. My dentist made the move years ago. Same with my eye doctor, known those two guys since childhood. Walmart kinda blazed that business model trail.
“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4293739
03/01/25 10:30 PM
03/01/25 10:30 PM
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,585 Cullman,AL
turkey_killer
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,585
Cullman,AL
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This isn't true. It's a scare tactic by PBMs. This is a PBMs excuse to cause people to be against needed reform that would keep them honest. Look up spread pricing by PBMs and ask yourself why it's legal. They're robbing you and the pharmacy and made $194 billion in 2024.
There are no taxes on prescriptions. This is just a bill to help pharmacy's get paid instead of PBMs reimbursing pharmacies below cost and keeping all the money for Caremark, prime, Optum, etc.
Y'all look up PBMs spread pricing.
Example: totally made up but pretty accurate. Pharmacy pays $43 for drug (plus costs of label, bottle, tech, lights, licensing, etc) PBM charges insurance ($126) Patient has $10 copay PBM pays pharmacy $26 Pharmacy gets $36 total (loses $17) PBM pockets $100 spread
And it happens over and over and over again.
Last edited by turkey_killer; 03/01/25 10:34 PM.
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: turkey_killer]
#4293747
03/01/25 10:39 PM
03/01/25 10:39 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,951 Huntsville, Al
Bronco 74
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,951
Huntsville, Al
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This isn't true. It's a scare tactic by PBMs. This is a PBMs excuse to cause people to be against needed reform that would keep them honest. Look up spread pricing by PBMs and ask yourself why it's legal. They're robbing you and the pharmacy and made $194 billion in 2024.
There are no taxes on prescriptions. This is just a bill to help pharmacy's get paid instead of PBMs reimbursing pharmacies below cost and keeping all the money for Caremark, prime, Optum, etc.
Y'all look up PBMs spread pricing.
Example: totally made up but pretty accurate. Pharmacy pays $43 for drug (plus costs of label, bottle, tech, lights, licensing, etc) PBM charges insurance ($126) Patient has $10 copay PBM pays pharmacy $26 Pharmacy gets $36 total (loses $17) PBM pockets $100 spread
And it happens over and over and over again.
Thx you for reading the fine print. I’m mean that seriously.
"We have an opponent in this state that we work every day, 365 days a year, to dominate."
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: cartervj]
#4293786
03/02/25 08:04 AM
03/02/25 08:04 AM
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Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,432 AL
Gobble4me757
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,432
AL
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This is trying to save the smaller pharmacies, the larger pharmacies are already getting theirs. The larger pharmacies have a greater voice, thus, they have a better return rate on the prescriptions. The smaller guys just want to make the investment the same.
Next time you go to the doctor and a friend goes that has a different insurance but having the same thing done. Look at the Eob for each of you. You will see what the doctor charged and what the provider actually paid. Why do you think some doctors have quit taking medicare or medicaid patients, the reimbursement isn't worth it to them.
Small pharmacies don't really have that luxury, same as why small hospitals and doctors offices are closing, they can't keep the lights on because of the reimbursement. Medicare and Medicaid reimbursements have been very low in the shoals and one reason we lost doctors they the years. I think it is better now. Most health care providers have teamed up to split the cost and others have went under the umbrella of the hospital. My dentist made the move years ago. Same with my eye doctor, known those two guys since childhood. Walmart kinda blazed that business model trail. Biden cut Medicare’s reimbursement 8% in the last 4 years. Our private practice doesn’t accept Medicaid due to not making any money. They are killing us primary care docs even though studies have shown we save patients and the health care system a bunch of money by catching diseases earlier/helping people get more healthy etc. specialists who do surgeries don’t feel near the cut as insurances pay for procedures but not preventative visits
2017 Team Aldeer Turkey Contest Champion 2018 Team Aldeer Turkey Contest Champion
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4293788
03/02/25 08:06 AM
03/02/25 08:06 AM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720 Lower Alabama
Andalusia
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720
Lower Alabama
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Maybe small independent pharmacies need to form a national bargaining group to negotiate their fees with the PBM's. If pharmacies only make pennies on certain prescriptions then they must be making money elsewhere. Most independent pharmacists I know seem to be living well. Something needs to change but more regulations vs free market may not be the answer.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: CAL]
#4293801
03/02/25 08:40 AM
03/02/25 08:40 AM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,278 blount county alabama
imadeerhntr
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,278
blount county alabama
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Also If it doesnt affect medicare, medicaid, people with insurance copays and cash paying customers.....Who will be paying this?? who is left??? The middleman (PBM) will be the one paying it. They control what we are paid per transaction. Cost increases almost always are passed on to the consumer in the end correct? You’re saying that you are absorbing the cost if it is passed on to these PBMs Will they not increase prices? And I would really appreciate it if you could give us an explanation of what they exactly are and their function. Thanks
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4293802
03/02/25 08:41 AM
03/02/25 08:41 AM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 7,168 Shelby Co, AL
CatHeadBiscuit
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 7,168
Shelby Co, AL
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More taxes = more government = more taxes = less freedom Less taxes = less government = less taxes = more freedom
“It’s enough to make a man feel sour. Burning minutes every day by the hour. Just to end up gone like everything else.”
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Andalusia]
#4293813
03/02/25 09:00 AM
03/02/25 09:00 AM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923 colbert county
cartervj
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923
colbert county
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Maybe small independent pharmacies need to form a national bargaining group to negotiate their fees with the PBM's. If pharmacies only make pennies on certain prescriptions then they must be making money elsewhere. Most independent pharmacists I know seem to be living well. Something needs to change but more regulations vs free market may not be the answer. Maybe PBMs are the problem and why Americans pay more for meds than other countries Not knowing but it appears to me it follows the simple rule of costing more under the guise of saving money, while benefiting themselves more than the other parties. Does all of this fall under Obama’s goal of destroying the healthcare system to rebuild it under their terms. Come to think of it, Obama and his minions have sought to destroy the very fabric of America to rebuild it to their desires. He even said so
“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4293916
03/02/25 01:05 PM
03/02/25 01:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720 Lower Alabama
Andalusia
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720
Lower Alabama
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Insurance companies have a negotiated amount they will allow their customers to pay for a certain medicine if they get their prescription filled at an in-network pharmacy. This amount is negotiated by the PBM's. A pharmacy/pharmacist does not have to be an in-network provider for any insurance companies. Same goes for doctors, etc.
But you may not have many customers if you are not in-network with several insurance plans. If you agree to be an in-network pharmacy, then you have agreed to their reimbursement rates. So if the rates are not acceptable, then they should stop being an in-network provider.
This is how I understand it, but if I have any or all of it wrong please correct me.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4293938
03/02/25 01:57 PM
03/02/25 01:57 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923 colbert county
cartervj
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,923
colbert county
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IDK
Our local Keller being in Huntsville Hospital system denied I think it was United Healthcare Insurance Asked my eye doc/friend about it and it was cause of the slow pay/renegotiate process. I’d asked several others and they said that was the problem. Got all that fixed I guess.
The system is rigged and problematic
“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Andalusia]
#4294014
03/02/25 05:24 PM
03/02/25 05:24 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,899 Sylacauga
CAL
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,899
Sylacauga
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Insurance companies have a negotiated amount they will allow their customers to pay for a certain medicine if they get their prescription filled at an in-network pharmacy. This amount is negotiated by the PBM's. A pharmacy/pharmacist does not have to be an in-network provider for any insurance companies. Same goes for doctors, etc.
But you may not have many customers if you are not in-network with several insurance plans. If you agree to be an in-network pharmacy, then you have agreed to their reimbursement rates. So if the rates are not acceptable, then they should stop being an in-network provider.
This is how I understand it, but if I have any or all of it wrong please correct me. It is very rare for us (independent pharmacies) to choose which plans we are preferred or non preferred in. The way it works is I choose a wholesaler (McKesson, cardinal or AmerisourceBergen) and they tell us who we are to be associated with. They do the negotiating and contract selection for us. It truly is a case of take it or leave it
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4294189
03/02/25 10:34 PM
03/02/25 10:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,689 Madison, AL
wmd
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,689
Madison, AL
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Good. Now get rid of PBMs.
"Any way you look at it, most of the problems facing baboons can be expressed in two words: other baboons" - D.L. Cheney and R.M. Seyfarth
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: CAL]
#4294231
03/03/25 07:45 AM
03/03/25 07:45 AM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720 Lower Alabama
Andalusia
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720
Lower Alabama
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Insurance companies have a negotiated amount they will allow their customers to pay for a certain medicine if they get their prescription filled at an in-network pharmacy. This amount is negotiated by the PBM's. A pharmacy/pharmacist does not have to be an in-network provider for any insurance companies. Same goes for doctors, etc.
But you may not have many customers if you are not in-network with several insurance plans. If you agree to be an in-network pharmacy, then you have agreed to their reimbursement rates. So if the rates are not acceptable, then they should stop being an in-network provider.
This is how I understand it, but if I have any or all of it wrong please correct me. It is very rare for us (independent pharmacies) to choose which plans we are preferred or non preferred in. The way it works is I choose a wholesaler (McKesson, cardinal or AmerisourceBergen) and they tell us who we are to be associated with. They do the negotiating and contract selection for us. It truly is a case of take it or leave it Wow! Has it always been this way or has it evolved into the suppliers dictating what you get to charge for the prescription drugs they sell to you? Guess that explains why several pharmacies sell much more than just prescription drugs.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Auburn_03]
#4294240
03/03/25 08:17 AM
03/03/25 08:17 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 10,667 Alabama
whack-n-stack
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 10,667
Alabama
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Well every single one of these people needs to be voted out
Louise Alexander not in office Anthony Daniels Christopher J. England Kerry Rich Chair Corley Ellis Vice Chair Chip Brown Brett Easterbrook David Faulkner Jamie Kiel Jeff Sorrells Kyle South Kerry Rich is no longer in the house. He has been out for 2 years I believe. This is either not true or his name got put on by mistake. Neither is Kyle South. He resigned a couple years ago to be the director of the chamber of commerce in Tuscaloosa.
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Andalusia]
#4294250
03/03/25 08:58 AM
03/03/25 08:58 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,899 Sylacauga
CAL
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,899
Sylacauga
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Insurance companies have a negotiated amount they will allow their customers to pay for a certain medicine if they get their prescription filled at an in-network pharmacy. This amount is negotiated by the PBM's. A pharmacy/pharmacist does not have to be an in-network provider for any insurance companies. Same goes for doctors, etc.
But you may not have many customers if you are not in-network with several insurance plans. If you agree to be an in-network pharmacy, then you have agreed to their reimbursement rates. So if the rates are not acceptable, then they should stop being an in-network provider.
This is how I understand it, but if I have any or all of it wrong please correct me. It is very rare for us (independent pharmacies) to choose which plans we are preferred or non preferred in. The way it works is I choose a wholesaler (McKesson, cardinal or AmerisourceBergen) and they tell us who we are to be associated with. They do the negotiating and contract selection for us. It truly is a case of take it or leave it Wow! Has it always been this way or has it evolved into the suppliers dictating what you get to charge for the prescription drugs they sell to you? Guess that explains why several pharmacies sell much more than just prescription drugs. It has always been like this to a certain degree but has slowly gotten worse over time
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Guru]
#4294252
03/03/25 09:02 AM
03/03/25 09:02 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,490 Sylacauga, AL
poorcountrypreacher
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,490
Sylacauga, AL
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I know very little about PBMs and the pharmacy business, and I suspect that most of the posters on here don't either. But Cal does, and if he says this bill needs to pass then I want to support it. The last thing in the world that I want is to have to go to Walgreens for my prescriptions.
All the labor of man is for his mouth, and yet the appetite is not filled.
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: Andalusia]
#4294261
03/03/25 09:36 AM
03/03/25 09:36 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,614 Meridianville
DryFire
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,614
Meridianville
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Wow! Has it always been this way or has it evolved into the suppliers dictating what you get to charge for the prescription drugs they sell to you? Guess that explains why several pharmacies sell much more than just prescription drugs. Its why major grocery stores are able to service more insurance plans than smaller ones. When I dropped my employer insurance for Medicare Advantage, The Boss and I had to switch over to Publix. Star Market was not in network. Rarely do I go in just to get prescriptions. I usually walk out with $100 of groceries as well. To Publix, prescriptions are just a loss leader.
Last edited by DryFire; 03/03/25 09:37 AM.
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Re: Get ready to bend over at the pharmacy...
[Re: turkey_killer]
#4294305
03/03/25 11:29 AM
03/03/25 11:29 AM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 99 Mobile, AL
AU67Skeeter
spike
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spike
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 99
Mobile, AL
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This isn't true. It's a scare tactic by PBMs. This is a PBMs excuse to cause people to be against needed reform that would keep them honest. Look up spread pricing by PBMs and ask yourself why it's legal. They're robbing you and the pharmacy and made $194 billion in 2024.
There are no taxes on prescriptions. This is just a bill to help pharmacy's get paid instead of PBMs reimbursing pharmacies below cost and keeping all the money for Caremark, prime, Optum, etc.
Y'all look up PBMs spread pricing.
Example: totally made up but pretty accurate. Pharmacy pays $43 for drug (plus costs of label, bottle, tech, lights, licensing, etc) PBM charges insurance ($126) Patient has $10 copay PBM pays pharmacy $26 Pharmacy gets $36 total (loses $17) PBM pockets $100 spread
And it happens over and over and over again.
This is the best example of what's going on, and needs to be understood by anyone voting on this. Its not a "free market system" I believe it's a similar situation for Primary care physicians as well. Their reimbursement rates are so low, that's why they cant afford to spend any time with a patient and are just in and out, unless you have something severe going on.
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