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Re: Stock market
[Re: globe]
#4238630
12/01/24 11:14 AM
12/01/24 11:14 AM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 14,393
Some Marriott/Auburn
AU7MM08
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 14,393
Some Marriott/Auburn
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On a side note, all this savings is great, but if you’re mortgaged to the hilt……
Being debt free is first imo.
My house has a 3.1% mortgage and I owe $205,000ish on it. Cash is paying me 4%+, why would I want to be debt free when cash is paying me more and is more liquid than equity? I’ll pay it off 26 years from now I owe $55,000 on my condo with a 4% note, the tenant is paying it off for me and I have 12 months of expenses in a cash account dedicated to strictly to the condo should their be an issue, why would I make that a priority? I’ll pay it off in 13.5 years from now Credit card debt, payday loans, vehicles you can’t afford, student loan debt etc is a very different discussion.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Peach]
#4238636
12/01/24 11:33 AM
12/01/24 11:33 AM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 4,418
chilton, co.
hayman
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 4,418
chilton, co.
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Au7mm08 recon what your cash will truly be making you on top of the 3.1% interest on your mortgage after the 4% is taxed? Unless you have a very large sum of cash I cannot make this work out in my head. Have you figured your mortgage payment and worked it out for the next 26 years to see just how much money you will actually be paying?
“Everything Woke Turns To SH_T” Donald J. Trump
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Re: Stock market
[Re: hayman]
#4238639
12/01/24 11:39 AM
12/01/24 11:39 AM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 14,393
Some Marriott/Auburn
AU7MM08
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 14,393
Some Marriott/Auburn
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Au7mm08 recon what your cash will truly be making you on top of the 3.1% interest on your mortgage after the 4% is taxed? Unless you have a very large sum of cash I cannot make this work out in my head. Have you figured your mortgage payment and worked it out for the next 26 years to see just how much money you will actually be paying? With tax factored in, it’s probably a hair more but not much. Cash still has the advantage of liquidity VS equity which is the exact opposite. Most spare dollars get invested, not kept in cash. S&P500 is a reliable 10.25% over the long term. I’ll take the 7% spread 8 days week over a paid off mortgage, especially when I’m young.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: AU7MM08]
#4238642
12/01/24 11:46 AM
12/01/24 11:46 AM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 4,418
chilton, co.
hayman
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 4,418
chilton, co.
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Au7mm08 recon what your cash will truly be making you on top of the 3.1% interest on your mortgage after the 4% is taxed? Unless you have a very large sum of cash I cannot make this work out in my head. Have you figured your mortgage payment and worked it out for the next 26 years to see just how much money you will actually be paying? With tax factored in, it’s probably a hair more but not much. Cash still has the advantage of liquidity VS equity which is the exact opposite. Most spare dollars get invested, not kept in cash. S&P500 is a reliable 10.25% over the long term. I’ll take the 7% spread 8 days week over a paid off mortgage, especially when I’m young. I don’t disagree with what your saying. I like having mine liquid as well and not tied up in equity. On your mortgage however I believe if you drag out your payments for the full 26 years you’ll be paying around 150,000 more. The only other thing that would persuade me to do different is the liability of sickness or disability that would be unforeseen where you couldn’t make the money your making now.
“Everything Woke Turns To SH_T” Donald J. Trump
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Re: Stock market
[Re: fireman176]
#4238646
12/01/24 11:50 AM
12/01/24 11:50 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,614
Meridianville
DryFire
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,614
Meridianville
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? If you are self directed, listen to Ken Moraif's podcast. He is a Buy, Hold, Sell advisor with RPOA. In Nov 2007 he told everyone to sell. Did not give the Buy signal until June 2009. So while the fence sitters watched their 401k lose 40% or more in value, I made 2% invested on government securities. His weekly podcast has well researched opinions on where he believes the stock market is headed, estate planning, maximizing your SS benefits, etc.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Semo]
#4238658
12/01/24 12:10 PM
12/01/24 12:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720
Lower Alabama
Andalusia
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,720
Lower Alabama
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It would be different if CFPs actually beat the market. But they consistently and demonstrably lag the market by a significant amount. Year after year. I believe the number is 90% fail to beat index. And even the ones that do beat the market in a given year can't repeat their success, meaning it wasn't skill, it was luck. A CFP is not an investment picker. The designation doesn't have anything to do with that. I was going to sit for the exam before I left I did the partial AAMS my fist year (which isn't tough). The CFP is like a CPA compared to the local guy at the H&R Block. Both can do your taxes. But only one is going to handle setting up your estate or helping you structure your business. And not all CFP's are Registered Investment Advisors that can even charge a percent fee for management. Or at least they weren't in the past. This is like the argument of not needing a guide on an elk or moose trip. Sure you can do it yourself, but most can't and need some direction. Very true. My fee only advisor does a great deal to earn their fees. I learned long ago that my time is valuable and I can make way more money working my normal job than the money I might save in advisor fees by doing the research/time to handle my own investments. They also review with my CPA and do a great deal of tax maneuvering. My monthly Fidelity statement is over 60 pages so more than just indexing and very happy with performance for past 25 years.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
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Re: Stock market
[Re: hayman]
#4238661
12/01/24 12:14 PM
12/01/24 12:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 12,317
Birmingham
wew3006
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 12,317
Birmingham
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Au7mm08 recon what your cash will truly be making you on top of the 3.1% interest on your mortgage after the 4% is taxed? Unless you have a very large sum of cash I cannot make this work out in my head. Have you figured your mortgage payment and worked it out for the next 26 years to see just how much money you will actually be paying? Keep in mind; his mortgage interest is tax-deductible. Lowering the effective cost by his income tax rate bracket.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: fireman176]
#4238665
12/01/24 12:25 PM
12/01/24 12:25 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,623
Alabama
jmj120
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,623
Alabama
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? I feel like I get my 1% worth in tax savings and planning that a specialist can offer.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: jmj120]
#4238677
12/01/24 12:59 PM
12/01/24 12:59 PM
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Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,432
AL
Gobble4me757
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,432
AL
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? I feel like I get my 1% worth in tax savings and planning that a specialist can offer. This…I use my financial advisor to help me save in taxes. I’m a professional in my field and have a great financial guy who is a professional in his. I don’t have the time to really study to get proficient in their field. Mine does a small percentage of profits made…therefore the incentive is to make me money in which he’s done a great job thus far without me having to touch or even think about it. I know enough to be dangerous but not enough to maximize what I could be doing.
Last edited by Gobble4me757; 12/01/24 01:03 PM.
2017 Team Aldeer Turkey Contest Champion
2018 Team Aldeer Turkey Contest Champion
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Semo]
#4238686
12/01/24 01:16 PM
12/01/24 01:16 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,526
AL
cullbuck
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,526
AL
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[quote=Remington270].
This is like the argument of not needing a guide on an elk or moose trip. Sure you can do it yourself, but most can't and need some direction. Great point! Some folks need help…CFA & CPA. Others like DIY. Both can be right answers for different people. A huge economic correction that is looming shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone. Record equities growth for 15+ years. Just be ready.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Semo]
#4238704
12/01/24 01:48 PM
12/01/24 01:48 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
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It would be different if CFPs actually beat the market. But they consistently and demonstrably lag the market by a significant amount. Year after year. I believe the number is 90% fail to beat index. And even the ones that do beat the market in a given year can't repeat their success, meaning it wasn't skill, it was luck. A CFP is not an investment picker. The designation doesn't have anything to do with that. I was going to sit for the exam before I left I did the partial AAMS my fist year (which isn't tough). The CFP is like a CPA compared to the local guy at the H&R Block. Both can do your taxes. But only one is going to handle setting up your estate or helping you structure your business. And not all CFP's are Registered Investment Advisors that can even charge a percent fee for management. Or at least they weren't in the past. This is like the argument of not needing a guide on an elk or moose trip. Sure you can do it yourself, but most can't and need some direction. Spot on. My wife and I use a full service CFP that offers a full line of investments , he has his own "baskets" of funds he picks and manages. He beats the market for us. I use an Elk guide and I'm 2 for 2 on nice bulls with him.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Remington270]
#4238764
12/01/24 03:17 PM
12/01/24 03:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 5,415
Michigan
Sasquatch Lives
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 5,415
Michigan
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? Why do I need someone to tell me not to panic sell or buy a regular S&P500 fund when I’m capable of doing that myself? 1% AUM over a lifetime, ouch no thanks I’ll pass on that. Agree. I'll pass on giving away 1% of everything, every year, no matter what the returns are. THIS! I met with an advisor and he wanted 1% annually and total control. If you have a $1 million portfolio, you would be paying your advisor $100k over 10 years! If I wanted to pull $ out I had to request it from him and he would transfer it. NO THANKS. I have managed my own for years and done very well. It ain't brain surgery. I prefer to be in control of my own money.
Last edited by Sasquatch Lives; 12/01/24 03:17 PM.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: AU7MM08]
#4238769
12/01/24 03:38 PM
12/01/24 03:38 PM
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,864
lauderdale co
brushwhacker
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,864
lauderdale co
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? Why do I need someone to tell me not to panic sell or buy a regular S&P500 fund when I’m capable of doing that myself? 1% AUM over a lifetime, ouch no thanks I’ll pass on that. Agree. I'll pass on giving away 1% of everything, every year, no matter what the returns are. People love to make this stuff wildly complicated to justify paying 1% AUM…woof $23,000 into 401K+5% or so we’ll just assume for employer match $14,000 per year into Roth, Traditional or Backdoor IRAs for a married couple $8,000 into HSA which is triple tax advantaged. If both spouses are working(very common in 2024), that $75,000+ that is getting invested annually into tax advantaged accounts. Very very few Americans are investing more than that annually. How do I know? Because most Americans are shockingly broke. This is me . Hard put that much in my employer plan but my 15% is a Roth only the 4% match is not. I can do $7500 a yr into my Roth outside job. Wife is disable now . Can’t do hers anymore . My 401k and personal Roths are investing in the same 5 funds . Been good and simple for me . I don’t need pay anyone for advice . Most advisors I’ve talked too know less than me . Try get me be less aggressive. Heck I’m here to make money . Most people I know only use job 401k and let someone else decide where their money go’s and most don’t know you can fund a roth outside of work.
Brushwacker
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Sasquatch Lives]
#4238828
12/01/24 05:08 PM
12/01/24 05:08 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
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Do you all prefer to manage your portfolio yourself, or let a CFP do it for you? Why do I need someone to tell me not to panic sell or buy a regular S&P500 fund when I’m capable of doing that myself? 1% AUM over a lifetime, ouch no thanks I’ll pass on that. Agree. I'll pass on giving away 1% of everything, every year, no matter what the returns are. THIS! I met with an advisor and he wanted 1% annually and total control. If you have a $1 million portfolio, you would be paying your advisor $100k over 10 years! If I wanted to pull $ out I had to request it from him and he would transfer it. NO THANKS. I have managed my own for years and done very well. It ain't brain surgery. I prefer to be in control of my own money. That total control part doesn't sound too good, I wouldn't go for that either .
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Peach]
#4238841
12/01/24 05:22 PM
12/01/24 05:22 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,659
Boxes Cove
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With the massive amount of info on the web , there's no reason not to be a pretty fair stock picker when the market is flying high , knowing what to do after you buy them and when the markets are in the crapper is another story.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Stock market
[Re: 2Dogs]
#4238845
12/01/24 05:32 PM
12/01/24 05:32 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,043
NW Florida
fireman176
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,043
NW Florida
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With the massive amount of info on the web , there's no reason not to be a pretty fair stock picker when the market is flying high , knowing what to do after you buy them and when the markets are in the crapper is another story. This is the gamble. Know what signs to look for, that the market is about to tank.
Is it Hunting Season Yet?
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Re: Stock market
[Re: Peach]
#4238848
12/01/24 05:36 PM
12/01/24 05:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,584
Kennedy, al
globe
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,584
Kennedy, al
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I’ll say this and “leave it at this”, I have a little over 3% on my house too (3.2-3.3) but a home mortgage is not calculated the same as an investment.
Anyone who’s looked at their mortgage should know this. I’m at 3.3 and the majority of my payment goes toward interest, 2/3 of it. In no scenario am I better off paying a loan out over 20-30 years.
I figure I’m pretty average too.
Cars, boats, credit cards were my main topic, but a house payment where you pay DOUBLE over 30 years is not smart investing.
Everything woke turns to shucks
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