See above post
James 1:13-14 King James Version (KJV)

13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Satan is the one who tempts us not the lord

Temptation is a desire. Sin is when you yield to temptation.

Could you remind me what Jesus specifically said with regard to homosexuality?

Yep! Sin is sin. But I don't like the way that we are expected to have to accept and validate their lifestyles into our society.

Not much specifically. Jesus did however follow the Law of Moses which had quite a bit to say about homosexuality. You have to remember that Jesus was sent to the children of Israel. They agreed with and followed the Law of Moses. Jesus had no need to teach or argue every aspect of the law.

Paul however was sent to the gentiles and did teach on homosexuality since the law was a foreign concept to them.

All of this however is not to suggest that either Paul or Jesus intended men to live by the law. The law is a picture of perfection which only Jesus could measure up to. The law can be a guide and teacher but it is not to be the measuring stick against which we judge ourselves or others. Our goal as Christians is to become immersed in the character of Jesus.Love is the end of the law, for if we love others and God, we don't have to look to the law as a guide, we fulfill the law through love.

I appreciate your response. As usual, well worded and convicted. I also appreciate that you acknowledge that Jesus never spoke specifically to the subject. Any direction we get on the subject from the Bible is from the old law. If you've read it, and I'm sure you have, you'll know that a lot of those laws would not be acceptable in the 21 century.

Matthew 7:1-29

“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Romans 14:10-12

Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God; for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.” So then each of us will give an account of himself to God.


I'm not for or against the Gay's in any way. But there are a lot of hypocritical people on here. We all sin or have sinned one way or another. But in the end it is not our job to Judge the sins others have committed. In the end we will all be judged by one Person and if you have given your heart to the lord you shall be forgiven or at least this is the way I was taught.

Many of the laws , especially concerning sacrifice were types and shadows point to the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross. Other laws were simply hygiene, or concerning healthy food.

We don't live by the law today. The fact is that a homosexual is no more worthy of Hell than any one of us. All sin is the same, as far as keeping anyone from Heaven, and no one has ever been without sin except Jesus.

Jesus is the only sacrifice and payment for all our sins. By accepting his sacrifice and repenting (to change our mind about sin), we are saved. No man will live without sin in his life, but the blood of Christ continually cleanses us from sin.

I think the main question concerning sin and salvation is a heart condition. A born again man doesn't want to continue in sin, his heart has been changed. He may very well fall into the same sin time and again, but his desire is to be free from it. How to get free is the subject of another conversation.

That born again man, agrees with the law of God from his heart, even if his flesh still sins. That's why only God is qualified to judge. Only God can see into a man's heart and know if he wants to be free from sin, or just wants to continue in sin and be OK with God.

We do however have to acknowledge sin as sin, for how can a man desire to be free from something he doesn't consider as wrong. If a man is born again, by surrendering his will to God's will, the Spirit of God will teach him what sin is and what he needs to be free of. We as Christians don't need to be in the business of pointing out sin. We need to lead people to a relationship and surrender to Jesus and let the Holy Spirit do all the correcting.

1 cor 6:9-11 sums it up nicely.

Jesus also spoke about being Lukewarm. You can't agree with or be indifferent to a sinful lifestyle (whatever it is) and be pleasing to christ.
Why is it everybody can remember " judge not lest you be judged" but not much else. Christians are supposed to let their brother or sister know if there is sin in their life. In order to do this there must be judgment of what's is right or wrong according to the word. We all will be judged by the word in the end and there will be no arguments or appeals.

And that is why I don't worry about the Ten Commandments being displayed everywhere. Christ was the fulfillment of the law and through him we have a new Covenant. He died for my sins, and I am forgiven. This I know in my heart. It maybe that I often fall short of what I should be and what I do, and so I pray for forgiveness and direction.

Yes, but we must remember that a born again man is none of those things even though he may commit them. That is not to say that there is any benefit to sin, and we should all strive to be free from sin.

There is a difference between attraction for and lusting for.

Absolutely, but we must be led by the Spirit in when it is appropriate to help guide another out of sin. For instance, it would not be appropriate to start listing the sins of a brand new convert. On the other hand if a brother who has been in Church for years, still has a drinking problem, then it needs to be addressed.

But to continually willfully sin is totally different. The key words in the verse that should stand out is "were" which is past tense which indicates true repentance. Hebrews also states the result of continual willful sin. It says there no longer remains a sacrifice.

No sir.
I completely agree that we are not to continue in sin. Paul addresses this in Romans telling us that where sin does abound, Grace much more abounds, but that there is no benefit in sin and if we really understand who we are, dead to sin, buried with Christ and raised again in him, we will not continue in sin.

The scriptures in Hebrews however that you are referencing are not saying that there is no repentance for a man who willfully sins. You have to first understand that Hebrews is not written to gentiles. It is written to the Hebrew people who are coming out from the law of Moses into the covenant of Grace.

What Paul is saying is that if they do not depend on the Covenant of Grace and willfully sin by returning to the law, there remains no sacrifice in the law that can make them perfect. This theme is repeated all throughout Hebrews and I am confident that given the time and by pointing out this theme many places in Hebrews, I could convince you of this very thing.

All sin is willful. We don't fall into sin unknowingly. If I commit adultery or lie, or steal, or cheat, it was all willful. It was not an accident that happened without my knowledge.


In the whole however I am in agreement with your sentiments concerning sin and repentance. We all sin, we all shouldn't sin, and we should want to be free from sin. This freedom however only comes through identity with Christ. Freedom from sin doesn't come through striving against sin. It comes through realizing that Christ has already won the victory against sin and that we are one with Christ.

Those are behaviors we are taught from a young age is wrong. A young child will steal and doesn't know it is wrong until he is taught that stealing is wrong. The same with the other. Those are things that we must learn are wrong. So, from that aspect, it could be said that we are all born with a predisposition to steal, or rape or molest and without being taught that those things are wrong would continue in that behavior.

Being born gay doesn't excuse the act of homosexual sex. There is a difference in being homosexual and acting on those feelings. Like there is a difference in being heterosexual and sleeping with women. You can be one way or the other and decide not to act on those urges.

So, is the sin being gay, or acting on those feelings and having a physical manifestation of the homosexual thoughts?

Either way, homosexuality between two consenting adults should not be regulated by the government anymore than heterosexuality should be. It is not the place of the government to make laws regarding moral issues that do not adversely affect the rights of another.

There is no way in the world you will ever convince me that a man is born with the urge to have sex with another man. Take a quick second and think about the act of men having sex with each other!!! Its as unnatural as it can be!!! The parts dont work together fellows!!! Its a perversion of the natural sexual act between a man and a woman and its a sin just like any other sin. No better or no worse...

I agree, and it's just as repulsive to me, but it doesn't matter if they are born that way or not. To make that the argument is to not address the aberration.