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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652347
11/26/18 08:10 AM
11/26/18 08:10 AM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 8,579 Grays Creek, NC
bigcountry692001
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 8,579
Grays Creek, NC
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Water will affect them a well. If you are hunting near water thermals will pull down towards it. I have found that milkweed is the best way to check them. There is a ton of information on thermals on the hunting beast website.
"You cant manage a deer herd with acorns."
-Dr. Craig Harper
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652407
11/26/18 09:17 AM
11/26/18 09:17 AM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,784 Owens Xrds
AUwrestler
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,784
Owens Xrds
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Temp drop = thermals lowered Temp rise = thermals raised
What, and how do, other variables affect thermal movement, i.e. hills, swamp, lowland, wind? Anybody have edumacated knowledge on this? Other than the basics you stated, be mindful of steep inclines either from rocks or cedars. This can cause the air to swirl back on itself. Like an Eddie in a river. A light wind and thermals will work together. But heavy wind will push the thermal the direction of the wind. Don't get lazy and think that mornings = rising thermals. Really cold mornings with no wind will continue to sink. Humidity also makes air heavier. Use this cause bucks may be traveling on the bottom. I think the best thing to do is to keep a journal. Monitor temp and forcasted wind. Then write down actual scent direction at that stand and try to figure out why so you can learn more about all your other stands. Still learning myself, but I'm getting to where I like hunting mountains better than flat cause of thermals and hunting benches.
I believe that this is a practical world and that I can count only on what I earn. Therefore I believe in work, hard work. -George Petrie (1945)
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652444
11/26/18 10:00 AM
11/26/18 10:00 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961 Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961
Boxes Cove
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There has been a couple of good discussions on this subject last couple of years. They can be found in the archives if someone has time to do a search.
There's waaaay more to it than hot air rises and cold air sinks.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652567
11/26/18 11:55 AM
11/26/18 11:55 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567 Northport
Bamarich2
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567
Northport
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Good information in this thread... will add a few things. First, the more severe the terrain, the more the downward thermals will be. As stated earlier, if there's water (creek/pond) in the low area the thermal will be stronger. Second, when the ground you're hunting around begins to warm, the thermals begin to rise. When the ground cools, the thermals begin to drop. I used to think mornings = thermals rising and evenings = thermals dropping. However, that's not technically true. Probably the first and last hour of every day thermals will drop (unless it's an overcast/day where temps are dropping dramatically)... and everything else will see them rise. I was hunting on a hill Saturday afternoon and about an hour prior to dark, the wind laid and that's when my scent began to be pushed down the hill (as opposed to across the hill). Third, deer in the hills travel according to the wind/thermals - they know how to utilize landforms to avoid human contact... so unless you're hunting deer from longer ranges, hunters in hilly land should learn about these things and apply them.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652623
11/26/18 12:38 PM
11/26/18 12:38 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961 Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961
Boxes Cove
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Bottom line there are so many variables to thermals in mountains that cause changes over fairly short period of time . Figure them out now and in a couple hours you may be hunting wrong. Lota guess work and luck involved.
Does the wind override the thermals today or the opposite? Is the humidity going to over ride the thermals? Is the sun gonna warm up quick enough so the thermals are working before the deer travel through to bed?
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652657
11/26/18 01:14 PM
11/26/18 01:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012 North Jackson
ridgestalker
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012
North Jackson
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO.
Last edited by ridgestalker; 11/26/18 01:16 PM.
"The Heavens declare the glory of God;and the firmament sheweth his handiwork" Pslam 19:1
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: ridgestalker]
#2652719
11/26/18 02:01 PM
11/26/18 02:01 PM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567 Northport
Bamarich2
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567
Northport
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO. I tend to agree with your friend about the variable wind. Bedding choices for mature bucks would tend to confirm that fact... they consistently bed with back to cover/wind and overlooking an open area.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: Bamarich2]
#2652742
11/26/18 02:24 PM
11/26/18 02:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012 North Jackson
ridgestalker
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012
North Jackson
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO. I tend to agree with your friend about the variable wind. Bedding choices for mature bucks would tend to confirm that fact... they consistently bed with back to cover/wind and overlooking an open area. I would think a buck bedding in that situation is using a consistent wind.
"The Heavens declare the glory of God;and the firmament sheweth his handiwork" Pslam 19:1
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: ridgestalker]
#2652748
11/26/18 02:31 PM
11/26/18 02:31 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961 Boxes Cove
2Dogs
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 35,961
Boxes Cove
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO. Good post. Bout the only time you can get a consistent wind is on top of the plateau up here in the highlands . I get a kick out of the "just hunt the wind" boys, if it were only that easy. I like to find pinch points where they must alter their path and there's no way with the set up they can get down wind or down thermal either.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: 2Dogs]
#2652754
11/26/18 02:37 PM
11/26/18 02:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012 North Jackson
ridgestalker
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 10,012
North Jackson
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO. Good post. Bout the only time you can get a consistent wind is on top of the plateau up here in the highlands . I get a kick out of the "just hunt the wind" boys, if it were only that easy. I like to find pinch points where they must alter their path and there's no way with the set up they can get down wind. Yep. I try to get just a little more down wind of the does than the buck that’s scent checking them.My biggest problem is most of the deer are off the sides and not on top.
"The Heavens declare the glory of God;and the firmament sheweth his handiwork" Pslam 19:1
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2652830
11/26/18 03:37 PM
11/26/18 03:37 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 8,579 Grays Creek, NC
bigcountry692001
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 8,579
Grays Creek, NC
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If he is still around this would be the guy to talk to. checkerfred, try to pm him, he did a interview on a podcast not long ago and explained it pretty good.
"You cant manage a deer herd with acorns."
-Dr. Craig Harper
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: ridgestalker]
#2653778
11/27/18 11:45 AM
11/27/18 11:45 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567 Northport
Bamarich2
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567
Northport
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The only way I’ve found to hunt with a consistent wind is to hunt on top or the very top bench on a mtn. Once you start going lower the wind swirls non stop.The only exception would be a wind blowing perfectly parallel with the ridge or mtn.The worst case scenario is a wind blowing directly into the side your on in this case the wind just splatters in every direction. I believe older seek out areas with a consistent wind. I got a buddy that makes a good case for deer liking a variable wind were they can detect danger from any direction. I think variable scent makes them spooky not being able to pin point the danger. Hunting with a bad wind can educate a lot of deer real quick. Beating their nose is 90 percent of the game IMO. I tend to agree with your friend about the variable wind. Bedding choices for mature bucks would tend to confirm that fact... they consistently bed with back to cover/wind and overlooking an open area. I would think a buck bedding in that situation is using a consistent wind. Went back and reread the post and realized I was in disagreement with his friend... I meant to say.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: kntree]
#2653779
11/27/18 11:46 AM
11/27/18 11:46 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567 Northport
Bamarich2
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,567
Northport
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Thanks - Good info.
Its amazing what can alter scent travel, if you could predict it 100% of the time you'd be a millionaire. I'll check out the podcast and also see what infalt has to say on the hunting beast. Infalt has some good info when it comes to winds and thermals.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: AUwrestler]
#2654862
11/28/18 10:20 AM
11/28/18 10:20 AM
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 10 Mississippi
traindriver
spike
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spike
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 10
Mississippi
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Temp drop = thermals lowered Temp rise = thermals raised
What, and how do, other variables affect thermal movement, i.e. hills, swamp, lowland, wind? Anybody have edumacated knowledge on this? Other than the basics you stated, be mindful of steep inclines either from rocks or cedars. This can cause the air to swirl back on itself. Like an Eddie in a river. A light wind and thermals will work together. But heavy wind will push the thermal the direction of the wind. Don't get lazy and think that mornings = rising thermals. Really cold mornings with no wind will continue to sink. Humidity also makes air heavier. Use this cause bucks may be traveling on the bottom. I think the best thing to do is to keep a journal. Monitor temp and forcasted wind. Then write down actual scent direction at that stand and try to figure out why so you can learn more about all your other stands. Still learning myself, but I'm getting to where I like hunting mountains better than flat cause of thermals and hunting benches. Increased humidity DECREASES air density, i.e. makes it lighter. Use a psychrometric table or air properties calculator. For example, where I hunt, elevation is 300' above sea level. For 32 F and 40% RH, air density is 0.07974 lb/cu ft. If RH increases to 80%, density is 0.07966 lb/cu ft. Molecular weight of water is roughly 18 g/mol regardless of liquid or gas phase. Air without water is roughly 29 g/mol. More humidity = more water = reduced density for the overall mixture.
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Re: Hunting the thermals
[Re: traindriver]
#2654896
11/28/18 10:48 AM
11/28/18 10:48 AM
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,930 Owens Cross Roads
mcninja
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,930
Owens Cross Roads
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Temp drop = thermals lowered Temp rise = thermals raised
What, and how do, other variables affect thermal movement, i.e. hills, swamp, lowland, wind? Anybody have edumacated knowledge on this? Other than the basics you stated, be mindful of steep inclines either from rocks or cedars. This can cause the air to swirl back on itself. Like an Eddie in a river. A light wind and thermals will work together. But heavy wind will push the thermal the direction of the wind. Don't get lazy and think that mornings = rising thermals. Really cold mornings with no wind will continue to sink. Humidity also makes air heavier. Use this cause bucks may be traveling on the bottom. I think the best thing to do is to keep a journal. Monitor temp and forcasted wind. Then write down actual scent direction at that stand and try to figure out why so you can learn more about all your other stands. Still learning myself, but I'm getting to where I like hunting mountains better than flat cause of thermals and hunting benches. Increased humidity DECREASES air density, i.e. makes it lighter. Use a psychrometric table or air properties calculator. For example, where I hunt, elevation is 300' above sea level. For 32 F and 40% RH, air density is 0.07974 lb/cu ft. If RH increases to 80%, density is 0.07966 lb/cu ft. Molecular weight of water is roughly 18 g/mol regardless of liquid or gas phase. Air without water is roughly 29 g/mol. More humidity = more water = reduced density for the overall mixture. You guys is way more smarter than me.
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