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Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: Dallas County] #2741117
02/18/19 12:42 PM
02/18/19 12:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 22,062
USA
R
Remington270 Offline
Freak of Nature
Remington270  Offline
Freak of Nature
R
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 22,062
USA
Originally Posted by Dallas County
I'd order some fake corn off the internet (have a friend do it). Take it to court and throw it on the bench and tell him that's what's in the picture. One bad gesture always deserves another.


Great idea. Burden is on the state to prove real corn/ wrong doing. I know some folks use fake corn to lure in ducks, which is legal.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741122
02/18/19 12:47 PM
02/18/19 12:47 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 10,980
coffee county
goodman_hunter Offline
Booner
goodman_hunter  Offline
Booner
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 10,980
coffee county
I'd say "your honor, they call me Del-monte"


"A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers"
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741125
02/18/19 12:54 PM
02/18/19 12:54 PM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 38
Wilmer
W
War87Eagle Offline OP
spike
War87Eagle  Offline OP
spike
W
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 38
Wilmer
Ford150man. I don't know why you cant see it I just checked and it's still there. I'm not worried at all about that picture. I can post a picture of a 8point buck in the crosshairs at night. What's the difference in that and a game camera, still just a picture.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741126
02/18/19 12:55 PM
02/18/19 12:55 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,265
Ramer
ronfromramer Offline
10 point
ronfromramer  Offline
10 point
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,265
Ramer
Aldeer detectives strike again. I went back and looked at the picture and by golly I think that deer was alive. He should have just gotten it to stand up and walk to his truck and then finished it off.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741136
02/18/19 01:12 PM
02/18/19 01:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 19,259
.
ford150man Offline
Old Mossy Horns
ford150man  Offline
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 19,259
.
Originally Posted by War87Eagle
Ford150man. I don't know why you cant see it I just checked and it's still there. I'm not worried at all about that picture. I can post a picture of a 8point buck in the crosshairs at night. What's the difference in that and a game camera, still just a picture.



Again, I’m not jumping on you either way.


If voting made any difference, they wouldn’t let us do it.-Mark Twain
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741142
02/18/19 01:15 PM
02/18/19 01:15 PM

O
outdoorobsession
Unregistered
outdoorobsession
Unregistered
O


Personally, I dont think Id go commit the crime of PERJURY, which is a Class C FELONY in the state of Alabama over a freaking game violation!

Alabama Code 13A-10-101. Perjury in the first degree
Current as of: 2016 | Check for updates | Other versions

(a) A person commits the crime of perjury in the first degree when in any official proceeding he swears falsely and his false statement is material to the proceeding in which it is made.

Chances are the warden has lifted and copied every picture on your facebook page as well as your posts wording. He most likely has copied ALL this thread as well. I know I would.

Also, in your interview with him you told him you drug the deer to a bait site. Your words....

He most likely pulled any metadata from your pics and KNOWS the exact GPS coordinates of where it was taken.

He more then likely went to the site and looked for climbing stand marks on trees within 100 yards as in your facebook posts you mention using a climber. He could easily have taken photos of them , as well as marked them all on a map as well as your bait site, and have the distances noted.

Showing up with fake corn and LYING would more then likely cause you way more trouble. A felony perjury conviction could possibly cost you your right to own a firearm as well as put a serious limitation on your deer hunting..bow, x bow or muzzle loader only.

I would mark this down to experience, pay the fine and move on rather then use " fake corn" and /or lie in court in sworn testimony. The cover up is what get folks most times...not the crime. I wouldnt commit a felony to try to get out of a VIOLATION.

Just my opinion. Now if there are no climbing stand marks within 100 yards of the feed site, nor any stands hanging within 100 yards ( or sign that there were and they were pulled) and you TRULY did not shoot the deer in the bait and you feel it is worth a chance, then do what makes you feel better.

But if you were in anyway guilty..Id pay the fine and learn a lesson. The way the law is written with the "affected area" and whether the "deer was going to the feed" is very ambiguous as well and up to the wardens discretion. The chances are you would lose the fight in court anyway.

Only you KNOW what the real facts are, but after all this posting if I was the warden, Id figure you might try to fight it so Id do due diligence and go to the bait site, copy all posts and threads as well as any pictures...then if you did try to fight it and I had the proof ( only you know if he will..but if I were to guess.Id say he will) Id prove you wrong in court and if you perjured yourself, Id have you charged with that too.

Id also make sure to visit your property next year, camera with date and time stamp in hand and see if you learned your lesson.

Some time it is just better to let things go. This might be one of those cases. Just trying to help...but some of the advice your getting here could seriously jam you up.

ODO

Last edited by outdoorobsession; 02/18/19 01:25 PM.
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741156
02/18/19 01:33 PM
02/18/19 01:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,259
St. Clair
H
Hornhntr Offline
8 point
Hornhntr  Offline
8 point
H
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,259
St. Clair
Originally Posted by War87Eagle
Haha I want superspike, thanks.
Huntbig, I love the scope, its awesome for youth. You can re watch the video and check shot placement and which way it ran, how it ran......
Some uninformed people call it illegal because of its night mode, but its night mode is no different than any glass scope aa it also needs the aid of a light.


It’s a night scope. Granted it doesn’t do near as well without the IR illuminator but IS a night scope and it IS illegal to hunt with. And don’t say I’m uninformed because I owned one.

Last edited by Hornhntr; 02/18/19 01:57 PM.
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: ] #2741157
02/18/19 01:35 PM
02/18/19 01:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 10,484
Bham
D
Dallas County Offline
Booner
Dallas County  Offline
Booner
D
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 10,484
Bham
Originally Posted by outdoorobsession
Personally, I dont think Id go commit the crime of PERJURY, which is a Class C FELONY in the state of Alabama over a freaking game violation!

Alabama Code 13A-10-101. Perjury in the first degree
Current as of: 2016 | Check for updates | Other versions

(a) A person commits the crime of perjury in the first degree when in any official proceeding he swears falsely and his false statement is material to the proceeding in which it is made.

Chances are the warden has lifted and copied every picture on your facebook page as well as your posts wording. He most likely has copied ALL this thread as well. I know I would.

Also, in your interview with him you told him you drug the deer to a bait site. Your words....

He most likely pulled any metadata from your pics and KNOWS the exact GPS coordinates of where it was taken.

He more then likely went to the site and looked for climbing stand marks on trees within 100 yards as in your facebook posts you mention using a climber. He could easily have taken photos of them , as well as marked them all on a map as well as your bait site, and have the distances noted.

Showing up with fake corn and LYING would more then likely cause you way more trouble. A felony perjury conviction could possibly cost you your right to own a firearm as well as put a serious limitation on your deer hunting..bow, x bow or muzzle loader only.

I would mark this down to experience, pay the fine and move on rather then use " fake corn" and /or lie in court in sworn testimony. The cover up is what get folks most times...not the crime. I wouldnt commit a felony to try to get out of a VIOLATION.

Just my opinion. Now if there are no climbing stand marks within 100 yards of the feed site, nor any stands hanging within 100 yards ( or sign that there were and they were pulled) and you TRULY did not shoot the deer in the bait and you feel it is worth a chance, then do what makes you feel better.

But if you were in anyway guilty..Id pay the fine and learn a lesson. The way the law is written with the "affected area" and whether the "deer was going to the feed" is very ambiguous as well and up to the wardens discretion. The chances are you would lose the fight in court anyway.

Only you KNOW what the real facts are, but after all this posting if I was the warden, Id figure you might try to fight it so Id do due diligence and go to the bait site, copy all posts and threads as well as any pictures...then if you did try to fight it and I had the proof ( only you know if he will..but if I were to guess.Id say he will) Id prove you wrong in court and if you perjured yourself, Id have you charged with that too.

Id also make sure to visit your property next year, camera with date and time stamp in hand and see if you learned your lesson.

Some time it is just better to let things go. This might be one of those cases. Just trying to help...but some of the advice your getting here could seriously jam you up.

ODO
If I’ve been accused of doing something I didn’t do, all bets are off. I’d so or say anything to keep from being prosecuted of a crime I didn’t commit; with the exception of harming someone innocent.


not sure what the best way to handle them is but they shouldnt be on tv and gettn married and raisin kids

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: jawbone] #2741165
02/18/19 01:50 PM
02/18/19 01:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
14 point
WmHunter  Offline
14 point
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
Originally Posted by jawbone
Originally Posted by War87Eagle
I did say I drug that it there. So where is the proof that I shot and killed that deer over bait? Court room evidence that I shot and killed that deer within 100 yards of visible bait?


Once again, the 100 yards has nothing to do with whether you were baiting or not. If you put corn out, as you don't deny doing, and you were attracting deer to it in order to shoot them, then it is Baiting which is still illegal in Alabama. If you put corn out with no intention of shooting a deer feeding or going to feed on the corn, then it is Supplemental Feeding and not illegal. They should've just left the 100 yards proviso out of the Reg. It just confuses people and causes situations just like this.

Bottom line, don't put corn out during hunting season and there will be no issues.


^^^ totally agree.


Also agree with others that the OP totally shot himself in the foot by posting those pictures on FB.
While it is a crummy way for GW LEO to operate, the pics arguably establish probable cause for a ticket.
Which is now been done.

The pics alone probably do not get to beyond a reasonable doubt for a conviction.
But there is no telling what the OP may have said to the LEO, and he certainly has said too much here.
He better hope he doesn't have a certain kind of district court judge because the Court of Criminal Appeals would rubber stamp any conviction.

And as others have said, he *obviously* killed the buck over corn and the scope pic was taken immediately after the shot.
Looks like a neck shot and he has the crosshairs still on the neck where he shot him.

Hogwild's observations are impressive too.

I would suggest to the OP to stop posting.
And read up on BrentM's "Corn Baiting for Dummies" book, lol.


"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: ] #2741166
02/18/19 01:51 PM
02/18/19 01:51 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597
Elmore county
GKelly Offline
10 point
GKelly  Offline
10 point
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597
Elmore county
Originally Posted by outdoorobsession
Personally, I dont think Id go commit the crime of PERJURY, which is a Class C FELONY in the state of Alabama over a freaking game violation!

Alabama Code 13A-10-101. Perjury in the first degree
Current as of: 2016 | Check for updates | Other versions

(a) A person commits the crime of perjury in the first degree when in any official proceeding he swears falsely and his false statement is material to the proceeding in which it is made.

Chances are the warden has lifted and copied every picture on your facebook page as well as your posts wording. He most likely has copied ALL this thread as well. I know I would.

Also, in your interview with him you told him you drug the deer to a bait site. Your words....

He most likely pulled any metadata from your pics and KNOWS the exact GPS coordinates of where it was taken.

He more then likely went to the site and looked for climbing stand marks on trees within 100 yards as in your facebook posts you mention using a climber. He could easily have taken photos of them , as well as marked them all on a map as well as your bait site, and have the distances noted.

Showing up with fake corn and LYING would more then likely cause you way more trouble. A felony perjury conviction could possibly cost you your right to own a firearm as well as put a serious limitation on your deer hunting..bow, x bow or muzzle loader only.

I would mark this down to experience, pay the fine and move on rather then use " fake corn" and /or lie in court in sworn testimony. The cover up is what get folks most times...not the crime. I wouldnt commit a felony to try to get out of a VIOLATION.

Just my opinion. Now if there are no climbing stand marks within 100 yards of the feed site, nor any stands hanging within 100 yards ( or sign that there were and they were pulled) and you TRULY did not shoot the deer in the bait and you feel it is worth a chance, then do what makes you feel better.

But if you were in anyway guilty..Id pay the fine and learn a lesson. The way the law is written with the "affected area" and whether the "deer was going to the feed" is very ambiguous as well and up to the wardens discretion. The chances are you would lose the fight in court anyway.

Only you KNOW what the real facts are, but after all this posting if I was the warden, Id figure you might try to fight it so Id do due diligence and go to the bait site, copy all posts and threads as well as any pictures...then if you did try to fight it and I had the proof ( only you know if he will..but if I were to guess.Id say he will) Id prove you wrong in court and if you perjured yourself, Id have you charged with that too.

Id also make sure to visit your property next year, camera with date and time stamp in hand and see if you learned your lesson.

Some time it is just better to let things go. This might be one of those cases. Just trying to help...but some of the advice your getting here could seriously jam you up.

ODO

that's why you shut your mouth it ain't perjury if you dont say anything and refuse to testify against yourself it would be pretty easy to beat if the OP woulda been silent. GW would need to know exact location, time, date etc... without any evidence except a picture he posted if he had kept his mouth shut which I'm sure he didnt it could have just been a prank picture for all the court knows. the court would have to prove jurisdiction so they would have to know location not possible with a picture. I dont think a facebook picture saying I killed this deer is exactly a sworn statement either could probably have it struck from evidence if you didnt tell the GW any different. my opinion is pay the ticket you already entrapped yourself then learn from it and live your life.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741173
02/18/19 02:04 PM
02/18/19 02:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 31,681
Slidell, La
perchjerker Offline
Freak of Nature
perchjerker  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 31,681
Slidell, La
Now lets take guesses on how much this GOOF, is gonna cost the OP if (as many believe) he is convicted?????


Thomas Jefferson. The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

Life is too short to only hunt and fish on weekends!

If being a dumbass was fatal some of you would be on your death bed!

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741177
02/18/19 02:09 PM
02/18/19 02:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,498
Highland Home, Al
S
Squadron77 Offline
10 point
Squadron77  Offline
10 point
S
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,498
Highland Home, Al
Originally Posted by War87Eagle
I received a hunting over bait ticket today 2-16-19 (6 days after deer season). They have a FB post of mine printed off. In the post are 2 pictures of my 8point dead. One from my phone, one from my ATN digital scope. In the photos there is corn on the ground under his dead body. I killed him 120-140 yards away on a heavy trail where he was working a fake scrape I made that day. I cant drive to that location so I drug him to the closest place I can drive to (My feeding area) at this time I change the batteries in my scope and take a picture of him. Then I go get my truck and once back take a picture with my phone, load him up and head home.
I dont see how I can get a ticket for hunting over bait when they have not physically caught me doing it.

What are your thoughts on this?

I just realized in your opening statement you aren't denying baiting. You just don't think you can get a ticket because the GW did not physically catch you. Maybe you corrected this later in the thread.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: WmHunter] #2741186
02/18/19 02:20 PM
02/18/19 02:20 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 19,985
North AL
AU338MAG Online IMG_0051.GIF
Old Mossy Horns
AU338MAG  Online IMG_0051.GIF
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 19,985
North AL
Originally Posted by WmHunter
Originally Posted by jawbone
Originally Posted by War87Eagle
I did say I drug that it there. So where is the proof that I shot and killed that deer over bait? Court room evidence that I shot and killed that deer within 100 yards of visible bait?


Once again, the 100 yards has nothing to do with whether you were baiting or not. If you put corn out, as you don't deny doing, and you were attracting deer to it in order to shoot them, then it is Baiting which is still illegal in Alabama. If you put corn out with no intention of shooting a deer feeding or going to feed on the corn, then it is Supplemental Feeding and not illegal. They should've just left the 100 yards proviso out of the Reg. It just confuses people and causes situations just like this.

Bottom line, don't put corn out during hunting season and there will be no issues.


^^^ totally agree.


Also agree with others that the OP totally shot himself in the foot by posting those pictures on FB.
While it is a crummy way for GW LEO to operate, the pics arguably establish probable cause for a ticket.
Which is now been done.

The pics alone probably do not get to beyond a reasonable doubt for a conviction.
But there is no telling what the OP may have said to the LEO, and he certainly has said too much here.
He better hope he doesn't have a certain kind of district court judge because the Court of Criminal Appeals would rubber stamp any conviction.

And as others have said, he *obviously* killed the buck over corn and the scope pic was taken immediately after the shot.
Looks like a neck shot and he has the crosshairs still on the neck where he shot him.

Hogwild's observations are impressive too.

I would suggest to the OP to stop posting.
And read up on BrentM's "Corn Baiting for Dummies" book, lol.

Lots of dumbarses get caught by the po po because they post pictures or can't keep their pie hole shut and brag on Facebook, Twitter, etc. I'm sure the police are always looking on these sites for leads, and this is another example.


Dying ain't much of a living boy...Josey Wales

Molon Labe
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741200
02/18/19 02:47 PM
02/18/19 02:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
14 point
WmHunter  Offline
14 point
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
Yes, social media has become a major tool for law enforcement.
And it is totally legitimate.


"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741232
02/18/19 03:30 PM
02/18/19 03:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 648
Enterprise
S
stuball Offline
4 point
stuball  Offline
4 point
S
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 648
Enterprise
Went and relooked at the pics, if OP did drag did as he said, how are the legs still straight out. I went and looked at deer I had killed and then drug and all their legs were Folded back not straight out.


Do the hard right verses the easy wrong
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741237
02/18/19 03:32 PM
02/18/19 03:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,182
Chilton
P
Powpow65 Offline
10 point
Powpow65  Offline
10 point
P
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,182
Chilton
OP, for future reference the term "supplemental feeding" might serve you better than "bait" or "baiting" or "corn". It's the same thing but it's different. Like wetback and Mexican are the same but different.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741344
02/18/19 05:42 PM
02/18/19 05:42 PM

O
outdoorobsession
Unregistered
outdoorobsession
Unregistered
O


Gkelly the problem is that cell phone camera pictures these days have a lot of information attached to them. The time, the date and even the GPS location through geo tagging.

Ask of Timber2. He posted pics of a buck he shot before the season on here , with a story about how he shot it during the season. The picture contained the date, time and the exact GPS coordinates.

The guys here pulled that data..exposed Timber 2 on here about it. Wardens took note, investigated and he was charged AND found guilty of three offenses...based solely on the pictures.

Also, I dont think the wardens go though everyone's facebook posts looking for hunting pictures...and then corn in them. The OP was no doubt reported to the warden over the pictures on Facebook, then the warden investigated the lead he was given I would guess. One of his "Friends" on Facebook...may not be such a good "Friend"..lol.

Modern technology is a two sided sword.

Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: ] #2741349
02/18/19 05:48 PM
02/18/19 05:48 PM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,680
AL/GA
Bamaturkeykilla Offline
8 point
Bamaturkeykilla  Offline
8 point
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,680
AL/GA
Originally Posted by outdoorobsession
Gkelly the problem is that cell phone camera pictures these days have a lot of information attached to them. The time, the date and even the GPS location through geo tagging.

Ask of Timber2. He posted pics of a buck he shot before the season on here , with a story about how he shot it during the season. The picture contained the date, time and the exact GPS coordinates.

The guys here pulled that data..exposed Timber 2 on here about it. Wardens took note, investigated and he was charged AND found guilty of three offenses...based solely on the pictures.

Also, I dont think the wardens go though everyone's facebook posts looking for hunting pictures...and then corn in them. The OP was no doubt reported to the warden over the pictures on Facebook, then the warden investigated the lead he was given I would guess. One of his "Friends" on Facebook...may not be such a good "Friend"..lol.

Modern technology is a two sided sword.


Most folks don't know how to disable it on their phone or either didn't know it existed.


There are two rules for success: 1. Never tell everything you know.
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741420
02/18/19 06:56 PM
02/18/19 06:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 10,722
Past Ol’ man Finley’s plac...
Southwood7 Offline
Booner
Southwood7  Offline
Booner
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 10,722
Past Ol’ man Finley’s plac...

Originally Posted by War87Eagle
It's still there. I just looked at it to double check. We are not friends on fb so you cant see it.


I’m telling you, it was there and now it’s not.

One more question. I’m curious why did you change the batteries in your scope just to take a pic of the deer after you had drug him out of the woods? Obviously the scope pics aren’t very good. So what was the point of going through that trouble?



The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life.
Job 33:4
Re: Proof requirements for hunting over bait [Re: War87Eagle] #2741427
02/18/19 07:05 PM
02/18/19 07:05 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 20,017
PDL, Fl
T
timbercruiser Offline
Freak of Nature
timbercruiser  Offline
Freak of Nature
T
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 20,017
PDL, Fl
I think he posted the Facebook picture and sent in his Game Check within a minute or so, too quick.

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