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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: capehorn24]
#2873757
08/08/19 10:09 PM
08/08/19 10:09 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 10,552 Alabama
whack-n-stack
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 10,552
Alabama
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Yeah, I’d look at how many jobs a union leader created before I started paying him to lead me. Plant union jobs are controlled by the CO. not the unions. Similar the trade union is approached by the Co. with XXX amount of jobs. So, if I understand the abbreviations correctly, the company(CO) solicits employees from the union leader. The union leader chooses and sends union members to the job? In your case, who signs the paycheck to the union members?
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: whack-n-stack]
#2873773
08/08/19 10:26 PM
08/08/19 10:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655 Prattville Al.
capehorn24
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655
Prattville Al.
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Yeah, I’d look at how many jobs a union leader created before I started paying him to lead me. Plant union jobs are controlled by the CO. not the unions. Similar the trade union is approached by the Co. with XXX amount of jobs. So, if I understand the abbreviations correctly, the company(CO) solicits employees from the union leader. The union leader chooses and sends union members to the job? In your case, who signs the paycheck to the union members?
In my case the company signs my check. I will say I work for IP they control how many they want to employ at our location.
The trade unions will choose and send however many a company ask for, for what ever the job is they are wanting done. From my understanding the Co. agrees to pay the union members their agreed rate of pay until that job is completed.
Last edited by capehorn24; 08/08/19 10:29 PM.
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2873790
08/08/19 10:56 PM
08/08/19 10:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,466 Scottsboro, Al
jbatey1
Lucky Bastage
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Lucky Bastage
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,466
Scottsboro, Al
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You’ll get very mixed opinions, obviously. But I’m like Travis- Trade Unions guys and The load of workers in a plant are 2 different types of people. IMO
I’m an HVAC/ Industrial Mechanic and Plant Operator for a Google Data center. I’m Union and would bet that I make better money and have better benefits that any other tech/mechanic in Northeast Alabama. I’ve always felt that I’m one of the best people around at what I do, though, so maybe that’s why.
We have a crew of IBEW guys that are part of our operations team, some of them are also Operators. I’ve seen non union electrical guys a lot through my career and these IBEW guys we have would smoke any that I had ever met. They are sharp.
You’ll have trash on both sides of the fence, no doubt about it, but I do see a different level of pride from the Union guys that I’ve recently spent time around- whether it be welders, mechanics or electricians.
As far as the topic that Wiley mentioned- my Full coverage family insurance plan( health,dental,vision), my annuity and local and national pensions are not deducted from my hourly wage. I’m paid my hourly wage and then on top of that I receive my $16+/- package that goes into Insurance, Pension& annuity.
I’ve had good experiences with Union, but I know that doesn’t go for everyone.
The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2873817
08/08/19 11:55 PM
08/08/19 11:55 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,341 athens
boker
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,341
athens
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I was talked into joining a union. Spent 5 years going through an apprenticeship. Was constantly told it gets better when you top out. I was told how the union stood up for its members and always did the right thing. All lies!! Unions are corrupt , there’s more unfair treatment and back stabbing in unions , bottom line I wouldn’t trust a union again.
boker
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: boker]
#2873818
08/09/19 12:03 AM
08/09/19 12:03 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,466 Scottsboro, Al
jbatey1
Lucky Bastage
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Lucky Bastage
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,466
Scottsboro, Al
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I was talked into joining a union. Spent 5 years going through an apprenticeship. Was constantly told it gets better when you top out. I was told how the union stood up for its members and always did the right thing. All lies!! Unions are corrupt , there’s more unfair treatment and back stabbing in unions , bottom line I wouldn’t trust a union again. What type of work or Union?
The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2873824
08/09/19 12:40 AM
08/09/19 12:40 AM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597 Elmore county
GKelly
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597
Elmore county
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unions are a good way to negotiate your self out of a job may be good in the short term but look at detroit nuff said. your employer is only gonna put up with so much profit loss and BS before they relocate operations.
Last edited by GKelly; 08/09/19 12:41 AM.
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: GKelly]
#2873836
08/09/19 05:12 AM
08/09/19 05:12 AM
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655 Prattville Al.
capehorn24
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655
Prattville Al.
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unions are a good way to negotiate your self out of a job may be good in the short term but look at detroit nuff said. your employer is only gonna put up with so much profit loss and BS before they relocate operations. Your right the Co. is only going to put up with so much P/L before they move or discontinue operation. Has UAW hurt their selves in the past, probably. Has only union plants relocated because of the BS, not sure but will guess and say no. I guess part of my problem with this is, IF wages and BS were the reason for leaving then why are we paying a lot more for the autos we drive.? There was an earlier thread about someone's livelihood and all were saying man up and ask for a raise or drag up and find other opportunities, what's the difference?
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2873841
08/09/19 05:44 AM
08/09/19 05:44 AM
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,238 Sterrett, AL, USA
stkshtr
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,238
Sterrett, AL, USA
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I've been in CWA 3902 for almost 30 years. Ours has changed throughout the years and I don't see as many low life workers as I used to see. It's not because of the union, it's just the change in workers. I see good and bad and I've always had a problem with the union sending money to the democratic party but I also understand that it's because democrats support unions more than republicans. I can say I would never make what I make without the union here and I wouldn't have the training I have if not for the union. In our case, the union makes things more even as far as training and overtime equalization that otherwise would be given to the bosses' favorite kiss ups. I have seen good and bad throughout the years but overall I see the need for it here. My dad was a career management employee and he would always say he liked the union because anything we got would also raise the management higher as well. I very rarely see any issue between craft/management because of the union. If I do it's usually someone who makes that an issue, usually a bad employee all around on either side.
CISM- Firefighter Chaplain-C.E.R.T. Instructor Refuel Ministries-HAM (KM4LBG)
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: stkshtr]
#2873858
08/09/19 06:40 AM
08/09/19 06:40 AM
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Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 2,331 Helena
700ltr308
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 2,331
Helena
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So you voted for hildabeast? I've been in CWA 3902 for almost 30 years. Ours has changed throughout the years and I don't see as many low life workers as I used to see. It's not because of the union, it's just the change in workers. I see good and bad and I've always had a problem with the union sending money to the democratic party but I also understand that it's because democrats support unions more than republicans. I can say I would never make what I make without the union here and I wouldn't have the training I have if not for the union. In our case, the union makes things more even as far as training and overtime equalization that otherwise would be given to the bosses' favorite kiss ups. I have seen good and bad throughout the years but overall I see the need for it here. My dad was a career management employee and he would always say he liked the union because anything we got would also raise the management higher as well. I very rarely see any issue between craft/management because of the union. If I do it's usually someone who makes that an issue, usually a bad employee all around on either side.
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: 700ltr308]
#2873974
08/09/19 09:12 AM
08/09/19 09:12 AM
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655 Prattville Al.
capehorn24
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,655
Prattville Al.
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So you voted for hildabeast? I've been in CWA 3902 for almost 30 years. Ours has changed throughout the years and I don't see as many low life workers as I used to see. It's not because of the union, it's just the change in workers. I see good and bad and I've always had a problem with the union sending money to the democratic party but I also understand that it's because democrats support unions more than republicans. I can say I would never make what I make without the union here and I wouldn't have the training I have if not for the union. In our case, the union makes things more even as far as training and overtime equalization that otherwise would be given to the bosses' favorite kiss ups. I have seen good and bad throughout the years but overall I see the need for it here. My dad was a career management employee and he would always say he liked the union because anything we got would also raise the management higher as well. I very rarely see any issue between craft/management because of the union. If I do it's usually someone who makes that an issue, usually a bad employee all around on either side. There are a lot of non union folks who voted for hildabeast, don't assume because we pay union dues we always voted democrat. Never have and don't plan on starting anytime soon. And if you have any age to you your parents probably voted democrat. Wasn't directed at me but I will answer
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2873993
08/09/19 09:30 AM
08/09/19 09:30 AM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,012 AL
hunterbuck
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,012
AL
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So you voted for hildabeast? I've been in CWA 3902 for almost 30 years. Ours has changed throughout the years and I don't see as many low life workers as I used to see. It's not because of the union, it's just the change in workers. I see good and bad and I've always had a problem with the union sending money to the democratic party but I also understand that it's because democrats support unions more than republicans. I can say I would never make what I make without the union here and I wouldn't have the training I have if not for the union. In our case, the union makes things more even as far as training and overtime equalization that otherwise would be given to the bosses' favorite kiss ups. I have seen good and bad throughout the years but overall I see the need for it here. My dad was a career management employee and he would always say he liked the union because anything we got would also raise the management higher as well. I very rarely see any issue between craft/management because of the union. If I do it's usually someone who makes that an issue, usually a bad employee all around on either side. There are a lot of non union folks who voted for hildabeast, don't assume because we pay union dues we always voted democrat. Never have and don't plan on starting anytime soon. And if you have any age to you your parents probably voted democrat. Wasn't directed at me but I will answer The millions/billions of dollars that unions contribute to democrats have a lot larger voice in policy making than your vote does.
"You think I care? Roll Damn Tide"
Have you tried Google?
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: ]
#2874230
08/09/19 02:04 PM
08/09/19 02:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 6,661 Trussville Alabama
inatree
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 6,661
Trussville Alabama
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I worked at USW mill. Pay and benefits were great. But the union basically kept the sorriest people working. A sorry worker will get a promotion before a hard worker if they have any time on them. I mean can hire on the same job on the same day and the one with the older birthday wins. I lost faith in my union when I got laid off and they called me back to take a position paying $110 per hour less and rotating shifts after I had paid my dues to get to a straight day job and they didn't stand up for me and help. I won't be taking another USW job I can promise you that.
Free men aren't equal and equal men aren't free! I choose to defend my freedom!
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: hunterbuck]
#2874241
08/09/19 02:26 PM
08/09/19 02:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9,661 Pisgah Al
Bigbamaboy
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9,661
Pisgah Al
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So you voted for hildabeast? I've been in CWA 3902 for almost 30 years. Ours has changed throughout the years and I don't see as many low life workers as I used to see. It's not because of the union, it's just the change in workers. I see good and bad and I've always had a problem with the union sending money to the democratic party but I also understand that it's because democrats support unions more than republicans. I can say I would never make what I make without the union here and I wouldn't have the training I have if not for the union. In our case, the union makes things more even as far as training and overtime equalization that otherwise would be given to the bosses' favorite kiss ups. I have seen good and bad throughout the years but overall I see the need for it here. My dad was a career management employee and he would always say he liked the union because anything we got would also raise the management higher as well. I very rarely see any issue between craft/management because of the union. If I do it's usually someone who makes that an issue, usually a bad employee all around on either side. There are a lot of non union folks who voted for hildabeast, don't assume because we pay union dues we always voted democrat. Never have and don't plan on starting anytime soon. And if you have any age to you your parents probably voted democrat. Wasn't directed at me but I will answer The millions/billions of dollars that unions contribute to democrats have a lot larger voice in policy making than your vote does. It’s true that, historically, union and dems go hand in hand. That being said, the dem party has moved into full blown socialism. There is, in the IBEW at least, a steady shift taking place. The old guys are being replaced and the membership is moving toward the right. Most of the union guys I know will stand flat footed and tell you they voted for Trump. I follow the IBEW FB page. It has moved more and more right to the point I’d say the majority are Trump supporters. Ppl are smart enough to realize that it’s a strong economy and job market that makes a strong union... not the other way around. Life long conservatives like myself are becoming the norm instead of the exception.
Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: Wiley Coyote]
#2874244
08/09/19 02:29 PM
08/09/19 02:29 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 11,822 Huntsville
JUGHEAD
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 11,822
Huntsville
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As far as qualified electricians on the bench, I needed a man for a couple of weeks in Muscle Shoals and the 558 in Sheffield sent me a guy that had been out drinking all night, he was still drunk and smelled like a brewery. I called them and told them I'd do the job by my damn self. The 558 was and may still be a cesspool of worthless/well protected asshats. I heard countless stories of how they scheduled twice as many electricians as needed on a project and they'd take turns with half leaving one day and the other half the next day leaving the site to do personal things for 8 hours and be on the TVA clock. That was in the late 90s and I've despised unions ever since. I worked hand in hand with a bunch of em during the Unit 1 restart at Browns Ferry. My company also supported some projects on the operational units. The guys we would get on the operational unit projects were TOP NOTCH. A bunch of the 558 guys we got on the Unit 1 restart effort weren't worth a damn plug nickel. Downright, flat out, sorry, lying, good for nothing leeches that would bust their arses at one thing and one thing only.....avoiding work. There were a couple of them I would love to have punched in the mouth with some of the chit they pulled and lies they told before I finally said piss on all of this and went back to the aerospace industry. I would rather go hungry than to have to work on a team with several of those cats again. And the sad thing was....the union went to bat for them...every single time.
Last edited by JUGHEAD; 08/09/19 02:29 PM.
"The only reason I shoot a 3.5" shell for turkeys is because they don't make a 4" one." - t123winters
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Re: Need some schooling on unions
[Re: DryFire]
#2874260
08/09/19 02:47 PM
08/09/19 02:47 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 14,248 Chilton County
MarksOutdoors
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 14,248
Chilton County
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1. I walk into Henry Ford hospital with a Detroit Free Press newspaper. It is literally grabbed from my hands and thrown in the trash because the union was striking and supporting "scabs" would not be tolerated.
2. At the convention center in Pittsburg, I needed an extension cord ran to a projector I was going to use for a presentation. Can't walk over and grab one and plug it in myself. Nope, I have to wait on some union member to walk over grab one and plug it in for me.
3. I was waiting for a operator to start a computer job for me to start testing some important software upgrades (old mainframe days). Had to wait until he finished his mandated union break. I couldn't walk up to the command console and submit it myself, other wise I was talking food off his family's table.
"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him." -G. K. Chesterton
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