Isn't there about 100fps difference between the .243 and the 6mm Creed?
.243 was rolled out in 1955 as combination deer/varmint rifle for their Model 70, 88 and 100 rifles.
No significant performance difference between the 2 cartridges. The biggest limitation for either is bullet weight maxed out right over 100 grains. Y'all say 100 grain is all you need. I say BS. I hope you lose the deer of your lifetime shooting that pea shooter it would teach you a lesson that just might stick:
There is no replacement for displacement.
Period.
That argument still holds no water if you are shooting a 7-08. Not enough difference between a 6 creedmoor and 7-08 to remotely make an argument. Both shoot a 140g bullet around 2700-2800fps.
140 grain vs 100 grain is a different ball game. Completely
IAnd if someone loses a deer with a .300 win mag more often than .243 at your camp....it was a bad shot. That's the gospel truth. Someone needs to learn how to shoot. Maybe they flinched because they were scared of the recoil. That's fair. They need to take up golf and hand me their man card on the way to Edwin Watts.
Why would anyone purposely handicap themselves? I don't understand.... there isn't a person on here that is not capable of handing the recoil from a .308. But some of you would purposely take a .243.... Why? To prove your magical bullet does what the other guys on the internet claim it will do?
Prove it to yourself if you want..... but some of us know for a fact that other cartridges are more effective. Saying that .243 is just as effective is a total joke. No it isn't. You can kill a deer with a rock and it will be just as dead. So everything has the same effective result as a rock using that logic.
Totally stupid. But look.... as long as your shot is perfect and you don't lose the deer everything is good. I'll be over here hunting with a much bigger gun and when the buck of my lifetime steps out at a bad shot angle I'll send one nut to chin.....and be headed to the taxidermist while your 3rd set of flashlight batteries are starting to die out.
No government employees were harmed in the making of this mess.
140 grain vs 100 grain is a different ball game. Completely
IAnd if someone loses a deer with a .300 win mag more often than .243 at your camp....it was a bad shot. That's the gospel truth. Someone needs to learn how to shoot. Maybe they flinched because they were scared of the recoil. That's fair. They need to take up golf and hand me their man card on the way to Edwin Watts.
That was precisely the point I was making. Some folks just aren't capable of shooting bigger guns accurately. I also my statement was anecdotal and not relative to the original discussion.
There are 3 certainties in an uncertain world:
1. All Politicians Are Liars 2. All Gun Laws Are an Infringement 3. Taxation Is Theft
140 grain vs 100 grain is a different ball game. Completely
IAnd if someone loses a deer with a .300 win mag more often than .243 at your camp....it was a bad shot. That's the gospel truth. Someone needs to learn how to shoot. Maybe they flinched because they were scared of the recoil. That's fair. They need to take up golf and hand me their man card on the way to Edwin Watts.
Why would anyone purposely handicap themselves? I don't understand.... there isn't a person on here that is not capable of handing the recoil from a .308. But some of you would purposely take a .243.... Why? To prove your magical bullet does what the other guys on the internet claim it will do?
Prove it to yourself if you want..... but some of us know for a fact that other cartridges are more effective. Saying that .243 is just as effective is a total joke. No it isn't. You can kill a deer with a rock and it will be just as dead. So everything has the same effective result as a rock using that logic.
Totally stupid. But look.... as long as your shot is perfect and you don't lose the deer everything is good. I'll be over here hunting with a much bigger gun and when the buck of my lifetime steps out at a bad shot angle I'll send one nut to chin.....and be headed to the taxidermist while your 3rd set of flashlight batteries are starting to die out.
Put the wrong bullet in that .300 and it’s highly ineffective too. Put a Barnes in a .243 and you can reach the vitals from any angle. A 200g bullet doesn’t kill any better than a 100g. Make a bad shot with ANY caliber and you up the chances of losing deer. A gut shot deer is a gut shot deer no matter how big the bullet is.
I don’t hunt with a .243 but my wife and son both do and that little.243 has killed way more deer than any other rifle in my safe. Hasn’t lost any either. That cartridge has been proven MANY times over the years as a consistent deer killer so there’s absolutely nothing to prove. Saying otherwise is ignorant.
All that being said I bet the .444 Marlin I have on order makes an even bigger hole than a .300 but still doesn’t kill any faster than any other cartridge if the bullet is put in the right spot. . But....with a much slower velocity it dumps a tremendous amount of energy into what ever you shoot and doesn’t ruin as much meat. And a gut shot deer with it is still a gut shot deer.
Average is prob 200 yards. I hunt one overgrown field we cut lanes in like a sendero and you can shoot 500 yards one direction and 415 the other. There typically isn’t time for ranging so flat shooting is very beneficial, as is bucking the wind. If shots were limited to 300 yards and in, I’d just borrow Gomer’s 308 and call it a day.
Or you could just move closer, but I guess then it wouldn't be as cool.
Isn't there about 100fps difference between the .243 and the 6mm Creed?
.243 was rolled out in 1955 as combination deer/varmint rifle for their Model 70, 88 and 100 rifles.
No significant performance difference between the 2 cartridges. The biggest limitation for either is bullet weight maxed out right over 100 grains. Y'all say 100 grain is all you need. I say BS. I hope you lose the deer of your lifetime shooting that pea shooter it would teach you a lesson that just might stick:
There is no replacement for displacement.
Period.
There must be some correlation here.It always comes to this,so tell us about the big one that got away...
And a 100 grain doesn't kill any better than a bow and arrow which doesn't kill any better than a rock.
Basically that's the argument.
Not really, that’s apples and oranges. In your opinion a .30 caliber kills better than a .243 caliber. But you haven’t explained why other than your displacement comment. I completely disagree. In my opinion, and based on a whole bunch of dead deer, I believe speed kills faster than bullet diameter. I’ve had way more bang/flops with bullets traveling in the 3200fps range and higher. So I now typically carry a 25-06 with TTSX bullets (3350fps) or a 7 mag with TTSX bullets (3300fps). Both guns make exit holes, both guns have a tough enough bullet to get to the vitals at any shot angle. In my experience both of these guns/cartridges kill faster than a .300 win mag. I guess I could shoot my 300rum and get those velocities but at a much higher cost and much more recoil.
But according to you the 25-06 would fall into pea shooter category.
Some of y’all take this “fun” stuff way too seriously. I like to hunt and I like to shoot. Shooting and hunting with the same gun all the time would only be half as much fun as trying different ones.
I appreciate y’all playing along today while I sit in the tree bored waiting on a deer to show up.
I do have an ol’ trusty 270 dialed in with Barnes that I take on days when I want to kill them really dead.
I just don't think I can explain why a .300 Win mag has more power than a .243 or a bow and arrow or a rock when the end result of all 4 of those is a dead deer laying at your feet. I'm just going to say I'm not qualified and eject myself from there.
No government employees were harmed in the making of this mess.
And a 100 grain doesn't kill any better than a bow and arrow which doesn't kill any better than a rock.
Basically that's the argument.
Not really, that’s apples and oranges. In your opinion a .30 caliber kills better than a .243 caliber. But you haven’t explained why other than your displacement comment. I completely disagree. In my opinion, and based on a whole bunch of dead deer, I believe speed kills faster than bullet diameter. I’ve had way more bang/flops with bullets traveling in the 3200fps range and higher. So I now typically carry a 25-06 with TTSX bullets (3350fps) or a 7 mag with TTSX bullets (3300fps). Both guns make exit holes, both guns have a tough enough bullet to get to the vitals at any shot angle. In my experience both of these guns/cartridges kill faster than a .300 win mag. I guess I could shoot my 300rum and get those velocities but at a much higher cost and much more recoil.
But according to you the 25-06 would fall into pea shooter category.
Hasn't been my experience, but whatever floats your boat.
They all will get the job done. Me personally I’ve consistently seen better holes, especially exits out of a 308. I feel like there’s a happy medium with our smaller deer, bullet velocities, and weight of the bullet. I have seen 7mags and 300 rums pencil through deer and 243s not exit/ no blood trail. It’s all relative to the construction of the bullet used as well. The 308s tend to leave fist sized holes but to each their own
I’ve killed them with 223s up to 45/70s, 300s....most stuff in between. With the right bullets, lots of stuff will go ‘nuts to butt’ on a deer, and leave a good blood trail, if it doesn’t drop right there. I’ve seen them run as far from the same shot placement with a 300 mag, as a 3300fps 25-06, as a 223, as a 45-70. I’ve seen them drop from the same shot with a223, that they ran 100 yards from with the same in a 300. Unless you tickle the CNS, it’s just not purely predictable....no matter what. Some 120gr 7mm bullets far outperform common 120-140 gr 6.5 and 150 gr 308s.... just because of their construction. I still say any 7-08/308/30-06/270/280 (love a 358) does more than enough for any whitetail, from any angle, with any good 120-150(165 for 30, 200 in a 35)gr bullet, and belts aren’t needed. 6.5s can fall in that, too. 25-06 will do. Going down to 223-243, or <120gr, and or under 2500 and <120gr....now you gotta be picky about bullets and shot angles. Sure, they kill great, when nothing goes wrong with placement or steep angles, but if you account for that going in, it’s no big deal...until it is. The 7/300/338 magnums give you nothing over the standard 7-08/270/308/06/etc on a deer. If you shoot them well, they ain’t hurting you.....but they’re still not as fun to practice or carry a lot, as everything else. Most everything else gives you something over the 223-243s, but that includes weight, recoil, blast, too. They’re ain’t no ‘perfect’, except for you. Even then, it’ll change over time, cuz you’ll change, too. A plain old 308/30-06 leaves nothing on the table to anything else for shooting deer. They’re downright boring they’re so good for it. Probably why I get bored with them and play with other stuff so much. The guys that shoot big stuff, and a their 10-20 pre-season shots a year, and go kill deer....go nuts. Do what you like. I like shooting, and shooting a lot, so lighter kicking guns that’ll kill deer, get to be really quick and deadly after you put several hundred to even thousands through them every year, between the range, and off-season stuff in other places...whether coyotes, hogs, jack rabbits, or whatever... just different visions. Do what you like and what works for you. I still think a 7-08 and a 358 are the best splitting of hairs that ever came out of a short action case, and a 280 makes the 270 and 30-06 senseless. the 6.5 will ALWAYS be better than the 6mm stuff, because it can run 120+ bullets, but it’ll never be as good as a 7-08, cus it can’t run 160s....wind and drop don’t mean squat when it comes down to it. You can account for those, if you have any business trying.
Man I been screaming how good that bullet was and can’t get anybody to try it. I’ve shot quite a few deer with it from 50-350 yards and it does a great job.
![[Linked Image]](https://i.imgur.com/O5Ohp2e.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](https://i.postimg.cc/90YGzMDZ/0225191505a.jpg)
the 6.5 will ALWAYS be better than the 6mm stuff, because it can run 120+ bullets, but it’ll never be as good as a 7-08, cus it can’t run 160s....wind and drop don’t mean squat when it comes down to it. You can account for those, if you have any business trying.(Custom).JPG)
