All that grass, all those rats, all that burning and management practices have been in place for 100 years - of course all during the population explosion of turkeys in the 80's and 90's. I have never seen as dense turkey populations as I did on the quail places around Union Springs in the early 90's. They had plenty of "grass" then, as now.
Your arguments are similar to global warming zealots. If it rains too much - climate change, too little - also climate change. Cold winters - climate change, warm winters - climate change. At least try to work with another straw man.

The reason for the reduction in turkeys is reduction in poults and poults survival. Unless something is going on that is making gobblers less fertile, the only explanation is natural predators. The natural predators have gone unchecked for years. I think I’m the next 5 to 10 years we will see an upswing in numbers again, due to lots of folks starting to trap. Improving the habitat such as burning helps provide turkeys and deer what they need and makes a natural predators job more difficult. I don’t know what’s so difficult to understand about that.

Are you talking about back when we trapped 100,000 - 150,000 coons per year in Alabama and before coyotes were as wide spread and densely populated??? Those variables have changed now.

Coincidentally this should actually be a very ideal time to watch this play out since we've just got through having a couple of the wettest years on record..... 2020 being third wettest and last year 2021 being the second wettest.....Its easier to see extremes.....That should equate to a rat boom occurring.......Which may have a lot to do with the massive 40-50% increases in the turkey harvest in some of these counties we're talking about.....This should mean that next year will be a good year too and if we have a dry summer this year you'll likely see a big crash that following year as all of these predators that are ramping up populations on the rat boom years dont have the massive food source that is likely occurring rat now.......

https://whnt.com/weather/alabama-experiencing-third-wettest-year-to-date-precipitation/

You do realize you are taking about quail plantation land that has, and still does, practice the most intensive predator control in the country across huge acreages right? Doubt they relied on trappers selling furs. Those variables haven't changed much on those places.

Maybe this thread will die now that turkey season is over 😀

Hell they probably have to or there wouldn’t be ANY turkeys left at all there’s so many predators around here. You’re actually making my point for me…..Anyone around here that really wants substantial turkey and quail populations are gonna need to trap and do it nearly non-stop…..The coyote situation today isn’t anything like what it was in the 80’s and they’re THICK as fleas around those heavy grass prairie tracts…..The places that do trap catch crazy amounts…..One caretaker told me they trapped 84 yotes on a trapping run that year…..Add to that the impact baiting has had on coons and we’re dealing with high, high populations of predators……Its tilted heavily in their favor.

That impact goes for miles too….…There’s a noticeable difference in leaving a deer overnight and tracking it the next morning around there compared to other areas…..You leave one overnight around Union Springs to Hurtsboro, etc and he’s gonna likely be eat up the next morning.

You’re dang right in using the word “intense” in describing the trapping efforts……The thing is though, we’re talking about 100’s of thousands of acres with astronomical predator counts now and really only a few folks doing some periodic trapping. Taking out yotes around here on a two week trapping run likely doesn’t buy you a whole lot of time before other ones fill back in…..probably even less in years when we have rat busts....Same for coons or any of them.

We say we’re managing for maximum wildlife output but we’re really managing for maximum rat and predator output and the other wildlife is kinda of a secondary side show to it all that is heavily driven and dictated by the grass, rat, predator dynamic….Don’t fret too much though because again I’m not saying that folks need to stop burning…..If I could design the perfect set-up it would have annual fire being used in some form or fashion somewhere…….Some things could be tweaked though to moderate the big fluctuations that are occurring and the heavy overbalanced predator load that is being produced…..Regardless of how you slice it, the numbers show that obviously happening.

Just a theory here, but could insecticides be contributing to the decline in turkey population? There has been a decline in insect eating bird populations across the board.

I look at it like this………there’s numerous factors effecting this issue……There really is no ONE variable that’s THE issue…..its an accumulation of them….…..You keep adding one more and one more and they eventually add up…….High predator counts, deteriorated soil OM levels, heavy chemical usage, legalized baiting, legalized decoys, etc…etc…..etc……They all just add “one more” until one more becomes too many. There’s all kinds of stuff that could be “fixed” ….. but point the finger at any one issue and someone will start hollering foul….

Neonicitinoid seed treatments (hope I spelled that right, most just call them neonics).

CNC in my opinion you hit the nail square on the head, when you state there are multiple issues causing a turkey decline in areas of the state.