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Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4053889
01/05/24 06:54 AM
01/05/24 06:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,663
Kennedy, al
G
globe Offline
Booner
globe  Offline
Booner
G
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,663
Kennedy, al
Space heaters imo on thermostats. They use very little gas and will run you out. If it gets really cold I will run the fan to circulate the air.


Everything woke turns to shit
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: Fattyfireplug] #4053896
01/05/24 07:31 AM
01/05/24 07:31 AM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 20,492
North AL
AU338MAG Offline
Freak of Nature
AU338MAG  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 20,492
North AL
Originally Posted by Fattyfireplug
Gas heat, always and forever.

I almost always find Gas on main level and a mix of gas/heat pump on upper level.

Why? Heat rises and a heat pump can heat adequately with help from the gas furnace on the lower levels.

Otherwise, I have no use for a heat pump. They suck

^^^^^ what he said.


Dying ain't much of a living boy...Josey Wales

Molon Labe
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: BamaBoHunter] #4053905
01/05/24 07:55 AM
01/05/24 07:55 AM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 805
Chelsea
Floorman1 Offline
6 point
Floorman1  Offline
6 point
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 805
Chelsea
Originally Posted by BamaBoHunter
I hate my heat pump, it runs all night on nights around or below freezing and our house is only 2 years old so its well insulated and has good windows. I would go gas all day, unfortunately spire isn't available on my road and we didn't want an above ground propane tank. If i had it to do over i would have buried a propane tank and went all gas everything appliance i could.

Mine runs all night too, actually wakes me up. Have to turn it down
To sleep and then run it all day to catch back up on temps. New house and
Unit has been maintained.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4053922
01/05/24 08:24 AM
01/05/24 08:24 AM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,266
N. Alabama
Reyn Offline
10 point
Reyn  Offline
10 point
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,266
N. Alabama
I use both. If the power goes out due to ice/ weather it’s nice having gas.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054079
01/05/24 12:55 PM
01/05/24 12:55 PM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,697
Alabama
R
Rmart30 Offline
10 point
Rmart30  Offline
10 point
R
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,697
Alabama
Fed tax credit for insulation, doors and windows as well as for some hvac types.
Id put me in a large gas blue flame wall heater ($200) for emergencies when power is out then id hit getting it sealed up and insulated good.
My house isnt all that well built and has single pane builder grade windows. All its ever had is a heat pump with a gas wall heater like mentioned.
You wont run around naked with a heat pump like you can with a gas furnace but to me its ok.


Ethical behavior is doing the right thing when no one else is watching - even when doing the wrong thing is legal. Aldo Leopold .. (except when it comes to trailer tags)
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: Rmart30] #4054126
01/05/24 02:15 PM
01/05/24 02:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
J
jbatey1 Offline
Lucky Bastage
jbatey1  Offline
Lucky Bastage
J
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
Originally Posted by Rmart30
Fed tax credit for insulation, doors and windows as well as for some hvac types.
Id put me in a large gas blue flame wall heater ($200) for emergencies when power is out then id hit getting it sealed up and insulated good.
My house isnt all that well built and has single pane builder grade windows. All its ever had is a heat pump with a gas wall heater like mentioned.
You wont run around naked with a heat pump like you can with a gas furnace but to me its ok.



Up to $2000 or 30% tax credit for qualified heat pumps of 15.2 seer 2 or higher. TVA also has active rebates up to $1500 for qualified heat pumps.

It’s fairly common right now that my homeowners are qualifying for the $2,000 tax credit and getting a check from TVA within a few weeks for $1200-1500.

TVA also has rebates for doors, insulation and windows, but they aren’t near as lucrative. Same for the federal program. It’s better than nothing, though, and every little bit helps.

The hottest thing going right now in terms of bang for your buck is Ductless Mini-Splits. If someone has a bonus room, add on, man-cave or etc. that they want to condition. I can get them $2k in tax credits and $1250 from TVA. In most cases that leaves the homeowner with a net investment of around $1750+/-, if the tax credit benefits them, on a fairly normal installation.


The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054128
01/05/24 02:23 PM
01/05/24 02:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 98
Mt Juliet Tn
F
FNG68 Offline
spike
FNG68  Offline
spike
F
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 98
Mt Juliet Tn
I will NEVER have a heat pump again. If you like cold heat it's good, and when the emergency heat strips come on you will think that the hands of the meter are going to overrev.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054274
01/05/24 05:30 PM
01/05/24 05:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,657
UR 6
top cat Offline
Freak of Nature
top cat  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,657
UR 6



Look in an outside wall to see if it's insulated


LUCK:::; When presistence, dedication, perspiration and preparation meet up with opportunity!!!
- - - - - - - -A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you have. Thomas Jeferson - - - - - - - -
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: FNG68] #4054473
01/05/24 10:47 PM
01/05/24 10:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
J
jbatey1 Offline
Lucky Bastage
jbatey1  Offline
Lucky Bastage
J
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
Originally Posted by FNG68
I will NEVER have a heat pump again. If you like cold heat it's good, and when the emergency heat strips come on you will think that the hands of the meter are going to overrev.



Funny, just this year we’ve installed somewhere between 150-200, not a single customer has called complaining of high utility bills or cold air in the winter. I’ll have to send an email blast to them all to let them know to expect cold heat and high utility bills. 😁


The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: jbatey1] #4054482
01/05/24 10:54 PM
01/05/24 10:54 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,834
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,834
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by jbatey1
Originally Posted by FNG68
I will NEVER have a heat pump again. If you like cold heat it's good, and when the emergency heat strips come on you will think that the hands of the meter are going to overrev.



Funny, just this year we’ve installed somewhere between 150-200, not a single customer has called complaining of high utility bills or cold air in the winter. I’ll have to send an email blast to them all to let them know to expect cold heat and high utility bills. 😁


Don't need to send me one . I'm guessing physics says all things being equal ( humidity ) , 70 degrees Electric , 70 degrees Gas is the same.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054527
01/06/24 01:10 AM
01/06/24 01:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
B
Butchman205 Offline
8 point
Butchman205  Offline
8 point
B
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
I doubt your exterior walls are insulated.
When I built my house 25 years ago, I checked the US Department of Energy based on wife’s uncle’s recommendation…he had one of those cushy jobs at Alabama Power Company that did energy recommendations for builders.

I was surprised to see that back then they recommended a higher “R” factor for Bham, Alabama than they did on Columbus, Ohio….its harder to insulate from hot than cold was also enlightening.

They recommended R23 for exterior walls and R30 for roof. 2x4” walls cannot accept larger than R13, and R19 mashed in there lessens R19 insulation to like R9 if it is compressed…R13 is better not compressed.
To have R19 walls, I would have to have 2x6” exterior walls.

In the roof, I paid to have 30” of blown insulation vs about 10”-12” that they normally put in. Tip the insulation guy enough, and he’ll blow it as thick as you want.

In upstairs knee walls, I put R19 paper backed roll insulation, then drove nails and used steel wire to hold R30 rolled insulation outside of that.
I was able to count ALL of the additional insulation against taxes due to then current insulation/energy saving tax credits.
I also was told by a Power Company manager AFTER I had built my house…they didn’t like to tell people about tankless hot water heaters because they were so efficient, the power company would go bankrupt….he said electric hot water heaters and AC units accounted for 90% of their revenue.

I insulated like a maniac, and have all electric Ultra-High Efficiency Trane HVAC units, with budget billing my whole house power bill is less than $250 per month year round.

The crazy investments on insulation and energy savings have paid off many times over. I’m amazed at houses less than half the size of mine have $400-$500 months in the summer (HVACS NEVER kick off), and they have $250 electric bill in the winter with $3-$500 gas bills.

My suggestion: See what tax credits are out there for upgrading to new insulated windows, gut the interior walls and add insulation, then resheet rock, add installation in attic, add vented eaves and top of roof vents or even power vents to roof. Swap to Ultra High Efficiency HVAC Units. You may get all of that counted off on taxes, and your energy bill would be stupidly low.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054528
01/06/24 01:27 AM
01/06/24 01:27 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
B
Butchman205 Offline
8 point
Butchman205  Offline
8 point
B
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
When you drive through Jasper on an icy morning, notice how some houses have frozen roofs, and older houses do not. They aren’t insulated as well.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054529
01/06/24 01:30 AM
01/06/24 01:30 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
B
Butchman205 Offline
8 point
Butchman205  Offline
8 point
B
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
Also I can build a fire in our wood fireplace, set upstairs and downstairs HVACfans to run (variable speed high efficiency units will run on low…and the house is toasty warm with the meter barely moving.

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: jbatey1] #4054616
01/06/24 09:08 AM
01/06/24 09:08 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,146
Cullman
BentBarrel Offline
6 point
BentBarrel  Offline
6 point
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,146
Cullman
Originally Posted by jbatey1
Originally Posted by bama7x57
I have purchased a 1930's house in the downtown area of Jasper. It currently has central air with natural gas heat. The neighbor is plumbed for natural gas. The whole system needs replacing. I've only heated with heat pumps in newer houses with adequate insulation. What would be my best bet to economically heat a drafty old house with very little insulation?



If you knowingly know that the insulation is poor, go ahead and tackle that when you replace the Heating system.

If you have gas, but are use to heat pumps. Go with a dual fuel option. You’re get the efficiency of a heat pump until it’s “too cold” and then you can have the hot heat of gas. With modern thermostats, you can control the switchover temperatures in which it operates Heat Pump or Gas.



Yep. Get the insulation up to more modern standards. Then add a high efficiency heat pump backed up by gas. I updated a home that was built in 1938, and have been very pleased with a dual fuel system. No issues over the last 4 years.


"To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth." - Theodore Roosevelt
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054622
01/06/24 09:21 AM
01/06/24 09:21 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,361
blount county alabama
I
imadeerhntr Offline
Booner
imadeerhntr  Offline
Booner
I
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,361
blount county alabama
Heat pumps= what a friend on mines brother in-law calls cool heat. Gas all day long

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: jbatey1] #4054634
01/06/24 09:36 AM
01/06/24 09:36 AM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,452
Tallassee
G
G/H Offline
14 point
G/H  Offline
14 point
G
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,452
Tallassee
Originally Posted by jbatey1
Originally Posted by Rmart30
Fed tax credit for insulation, doors and windows as well as for some hvac types.
Id put me in a large gas blue flame wall heater ($200) for emergencies when power is out then id hit getting it sealed up and insulated good.
My house isnt all that well built and has single pane builder grade windows. All its ever had is a heat pump with a gas wall heater like mentioned.
You wont run around naked with a heat pump like you can with a gas furnace but to me its ok.



Up to $2000 or 30% tax credit for qualified heat pumps of 15.2 seer 2 or higher. TVA also has active rebates up to $1500 for qualified heat pumps.

It’s fairly common right now that my homeowners are qualifying for the $2,000 tax credit and getting a check from TVA within a few weeks for $1200-1500.

TVA also has rebates for doors, insulation and windows, but they aren’t near as lucrative. Same for the federal program. It’s better than nothing, though, and every little bit helps.

The hottest thing going right now in terms of bang for your buck is Ductless Mini-Splits. If someone has a bonus room, add on, man-cave or etc. that they want to condition. I can get them $2k in tax credits and $1250 from TVA. In most cases that leaves the homeowner with a net investment of around $1750+/-, if the tax credit benefits them, on a fairly normal installation.

Not knocking your business, but it seems like the government and TVA are having to pay folks to put in heat pumps. And they know they will get their money back when the bills come in

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054635
01/06/24 09:39 AM
01/06/24 09:39 AM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,452
Tallassee
G
G/H Offline
14 point
G/H  Offline
14 point
G
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,452
Tallassee
It’s the same with the gas industry, 600 dollars to switch your electric waterheater or 350 to keep your gas one. And I think there are better incentives coming

Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: G/H] #4054653
01/06/24 10:02 AM
01/06/24 10:02 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,834
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,834
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by G/H
It’s the same with the gas industry, 600 dollars to switch your electric waterheater or 350 to keep your gas one. And I think there are better incentives coming


If you're building new in Scottsboro , there's some great incentives for NAT gas . Even get some $ for stubbing out for a grill.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: G/H] #4054665
01/06/24 10:15 AM
01/06/24 10:15 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
J
jbatey1 Offline
Lucky Bastage
jbatey1  Offline
Lucky Bastage
J
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,573
Scottsboro, Al
Originally Posted by G/H
Originally Posted by jbatey1
Originally Posted by Rmart30
Fed tax credit for insulation, doors and windows as well as for some hvac types.
Id put me in a large gas blue flame wall heater ($200) for emergencies when power is out then id hit getting it sealed up and insulated good.
My house isnt all that well built and has single pane builder grade windows. All its ever had is a heat pump with a gas wall heater like mentioned.
You wont run around naked with a heat pump like you can with a gas furnace but to me its ok.



Up to $2000 or 30% tax credit for qualified heat pumps of 15.2 seer 2 or higher. TVA also has active rebates up to $1500 for qualified heat pumps.

It’s fairly common right now that my homeowners are qualifying for the $2,000 tax credit and getting a check from TVA within a few weeks for $1200-1500.

TVA also has rebates for doors, insulation and windows, but they aren’t near as lucrative. Same for the federal program. It’s better than nothing, though, and every little bit helps.

The hottest thing going right now in terms of bang for your buck is Ductless Mini-Splits. If someone has a bonus room, add on, man-cave or etc. that they want to condition. I can get them $2k in tax credits and $1250 from TVA. In most cases that leaves the homeowner with a net investment of around $1750+/-, if the tax credit benefits them, on a fairly normal installation.

Not knocking your business, but it seems like the government and TVA are having to pay folks to put in heat pumps. And they know they will get their money back when the bills come in


Gas companies have incentives too. They just aren’t as lucrative for the homeowner as compared to what electric companies offer. On the federal level, of course they aren’t going to incentivize Gas.. gas is the devil to our administration.

Power or gas companies want as many customers as they can. That’s just business and they play the long game.

On TVA’s hand, however, their power grid is stretched thin. They think that upgrading to high efficiency HP options verses the old HP’s, upgrading windows and insulation will help them buy time until new power is built and in supply.

I don’t know how the rest of the state is, but this corner of the state leans heavy toward heat pump already. We rarely ever convert anyone from gas to electric, or electric to gas and we probably install Heat Pumps at a 5:1 to gas units.


The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
Re: Gas Heat vs Heat Pump [Re: bama7x57] #4054718
01/06/24 12:51 PM
01/06/24 12:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
B
Butchman205 Offline
8 point
Butchman205  Offline
8 point
B
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,793
Oak Grove, AL
I’m not sure what laws have changed, or what energy savings initiatives have expired since 1996…but when I was renting our first house, it was on a road front that had natural gas already plumbed through the community.

The natural gas company would “give” you a gas hot water heater if you had an electric heater and swapped over to gas…and vice-versa with electric if you would swap from gas and buy an electric hot water heater from the power company’s store.

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