Who did the estimating?

That's why I'm asking what areas are decreasing. Where I am located is far and away better than 30 years ago (eastern Etowah). Also, I've been in auto collision my whole life and in the early 90's we had 2 or 3 a deer collision repairs a year. Now , during the winter it's probably 25% of our work.

If it's an estimate , it's someone's opinion. Besides , if 2020 was the lowest , we're on the rise again.

In all honesty even considering prior years of die offs I’d dare say I’ve rarely seen a substantial decrease in a deer population around here. I know I’d heard Waterloo had a big die off back around 2006 due to EHD. I even hear that they never recovered. But every time I’m in those woods I see substantial sign and or deer. I helped with some prep site burns and saw deer and sign in those desolate places.

It’s why I mention hunter sightings are not the best form of data. It is full of biases

The better question to ask would be....."What percent of your potential are you reaching??"......There's a lot of areas that I'd say are well below. Estimates show we've lowered the population over the last 20 years by a half million deer.....roughly 1/3 of the overall population

How so?

There would be numerous contributing factors would it not. What’s the overall human population of Alabama compared to 30-40 years ago.

Heck I can look at Madison and can’t even find the subdivision I helped get started in the 80s. There is nothing along county line road that looks familiar. What does the black belt look like. I keep hearing it’s pine plantations instead of Ag. Are those pine plantations burned frequently and managed for critters or pine trees?

There’s so many contributing factors but you’re trying to point at one

Besides I’m not convinced the population has changed much. Instead I’m thinking the population has changed locations. Never saw deer in Tuscumbia 15-20 years ago. They kill some good ones now where we rode dirt bikes and atvs and we never saw one or even a track.

I think you’re looking for the bogeyman AKA doe killer to blame.

Does it have an impact yeah it does. Just how bad is the argument age class of does would probably determine repopulation

Exactly, we have less deer overall now despite them occupying more space due to densities being lowered in many areas…..Which we are still in the process of lowering even more now

I said I don’t think it’s changed much, just changed locations

You’re ignoring carrying capacity of said lands that’s why I mentioned black belt being in large blocks of unmanaged pines. Is that true or not? I’ve read that.

Populations will be fluid dependent on habitat quality. Is that true or not?
I don’t know any habitat that hasn’t changed for better or worse. Truth is, habits are always changing.

Try this

Coons show up in greater numbers when feeders are deployed. Why is that.

No, the black belt is not pine trees……Coyotes and heavy doe harvesting is why the population densities are less

Give it up Carter. He will never change his mind or admit he’s wrong. Too much time invested in the graph game.

I don’t have any reason to tell anything other than the truth….Not sure everyone here can say the same about their motives.

I don’t think the some of the farmers in the blackbelt who are having to spray there crops with a deer repelling chemical would agree that with that statement.

CNC you choose to tell people what you believe the truth is. But the truth is, you don’t really know if it’s the truth or not. The evidence you provide for your agenda isn’t concrete evidence. Could it be true? Absolutely. Should we make decisions on game laws based on it? Heck no. It’s not solid enough evidence. That’s my opinion anyway.

I think a BETTER, not fail proof but better, thing to look at would be the deer herd in other states that have allowed baiting for years. Again… just my opinion.

Yeah I’m out. He’s on his personal crusade

Curiosity was my motive. I know how personal perspectives rarely align with facts especially when bias is part of it
Humans are biased as hell.

it’s not always about who is right or wrong… Regardless of his methods, CNC is just generating discussion over a topic that matters to each and every one of us and that’s a healthy deer population. The problem is we probably all have different ideas of what exactly that means. We are privileged to live in one of the most diverse states in the country. Per usual, we as hunters are our own worst enemy and we attack each other instead of staying open minded and being willing to listen. What’s good for one area may be horrible for others but we’ll never know if we don’t talk about it.


I don’t have a dog in this hunt (<—— see what I did there?) With the exception of the biologists like mbrock and the big timber/Ag guys,,,,the trackers like CNC, Dano, IdahoMike, etc really do have a unique opportunity to see a much broader portion of our state than the average joe like myself will ever see.

We could always have another thread on T-Swizzle, Ukraine, or where to eat in GS/OB

He needs to take his charts and grafts to the head of the Biologists , Chucky and the CAB . That's why I liked ol 49er , he'd do more than just bloviate on a forum , he'd pester those who could actually do something.

Different things are happening at different places. Deer populations are not down everywhere, turkey populations arent either. And its probably different reasons populations are down in the different places where they are. Cnc is probably right about his area. But anything he would guess about some place he hasnt been is just that, a guess

Good post Brandon....