Thanks for the reply gobbler. It was an honest question I had to jughead. You have to have some way of showing that something is working or not.

The good thing about the perceived notion(whether true or not) of a population decline in the turkey population is all the current research. Without it, we wouldn’t have all this research going on. I’ve been more interested in the findings of the latter years of the poult’s life cycle to adulthood study than any of the others. I, like you have alluded, think the flying predators have a huge impact on this stage, as well as, through adulthood.

I’ve got a question for you gobbler since it’s been an observation for years

Jerry’s place and other landowners along with TVA lands along the creek system had numerous ag fields of hay, cattle and row crop. Always have been told hens migrate to open fields to hug for egg laying and poult rearing. Surrounding that area has hardwood drains and pine ridges for miles and miles. That creek bottom would entail 8 plus miles of creek bottoms.

Would this and or did this create a disportionate population. We’d see those big flocks occasionally passing thru during winter but for the most part it was an early spring thru spring sightings and then gobblers seemed to head back to the hills.

I always felt that was why we had so many birds to hunt. Would that not lead to killing too many? Thats some of my concern since hunters flocked to that area once word got out about the numbers there.

Thats a good portion of my beliefs

Then there’s a friend’s place that seems to hold the same number of birds year around. He has fields with deep drain of hardwoods splitting his place. His population seems to have held steady for years and years. Then again he’s surrounded by large expanses of mixed habitat all around.

I agree with this, we lack info on what is happening to turkey poults, especially after they reach flight stage. There is a strong interest in researching this and I expect to see something (in another State besides Alabama unfortunately) started soon. I agree also with NOT just throwing money at habitat practices that 1) cost the taxpayers money, 2) may have positive effects but no solid data and 3) landowners should be doing for themselves. That's why if we had the study I mentioned, we could rank habitat practices and their effectiveness in increasing or maintaining a turkey population. What is and is not necessary.



No doubt that winter/spring flocks inflate perception of high turkey populations, especially visible areas like ag fields. It's normal for turkeys to disperse out of winter flocks to good nesting habitat, etc, in spring. Even in excellent habitat that holds good winter flocks, they still disperse. Example, in the peak populations around here, I put out a deer hunter in a large ag field (hundred or so ac) with hundreds of ac of quail type upland piney woods to the south, large acreage of hardwood bottoms on a creek to the north. After dropping him off and on my way to my stand I could see most of the field. I saw a group of 20+ poults and hens, a flock of 35 longbeards, another flock of 30 or so poults and hens, rode up to a chufa patch on the side of the big field and got in a box stand where I could see part of the big field, the chufa patch and a powerline through the bottom with a greenfield. A group of 75 poults and hens came out of the hardwoods into the greenfield from the other direction of the field (came from northeast) and while they were there, a group of 30 + hens and poults came into the chufa. A group of 6 longbeards walked through the hens and poults headed to the big field. That is roughly 200 turkeys in an area I probably only could see 100 acres. Never seen anything like it before or since. Come spring, however, there were the 3-4 gobblers roosting on the creek that would end up in the big field during the day and a few, scattered, gobblers hanging in the pineywoods for the season. Of course we saw hens in the pineywoods and the big field during season but I would expect 100-150 or those turkey dispersed to surrounding properties despite this place having all the habitat components turkeys need and was well managed. There is research suggesting hens will migrate over 10 miles out of winter flocks in river bottoms to the nearest upland nesting/brooding cover.

Bear in mind that, for instance, I say pineywoods are good nesting and brood rearing cover. However that would also be "burned" pineywoods with a lush understory and a 2 year return interval. Unburned pine ridges may or may not be good nesting cover and without fire is terrible brood cover. It is certainly possible for your ag field edges to be the best nesting cover around. It is typically NOT great nesting cover unless there is little else available. But, as has been noted, turkeys at their height, were everywhere and successfully used habitats that were not ideal. It ain't that way anymore. I think they only use the best habitats now because there are less birds.

Flying cats I’ve heard them referenced to do a number on them.

I now see more raptors than at any time in my life

My little flock of 4 hens and 22 poults is now down to 15 poults the other day. They’re bigger than chickens so they should be good so they say.

On the other thread about trapping. I say go for it but don’t think that is that huge from year to year but overall I’m sure it is. I’m seeing poults everywhere. I mean everywhere and I know those places are like our farm and no one is trapping. I think everything lined up in the poult factory for this year. In bad years I’d bet money it makes a difference, but what the other factors? and can they been manipulated and utilized?

Like I mentioned a few months ago, I think it’s what it is and population is just gonna cycle up and down and that’s just all there is to it.