Sounds like the Arkansas local duck hunters wanting restrictions on the out of staters.

It’s a double edged sword.


Just out of curiosity where are these clubs and how big are they. You’re kinda unfairly labeling folks again!!!

Heck I remember when buffalo rock had their place and guys from up here literally slaughtered trailer loads of does. 100 deer in the filed and wouldn’t run off til you dropped a few. Yet some never ran off even while loading the dead deer into the trailers. There were a number of clubs like this

Where?......Southeast Alabama counties are full of out of state hunters…….Lots and lots of hunting clubs are from Florida….. ……When you see doe harvest being ramped up across the whole southeastern quadrant….its likely due to an increase in hunter density across the whole quadrant…….that would be my guess......

Someone will once again take the strategy of making my statement to mean that “out of state hunters are bad”……when what I’m actually saying is that more out of state hunters increasing hunter density gets more deer killed……..

Well which one is it Harold? Out of staters coming in and killing all the deer or all the in-starters with 5-20 acres baiting them up and shooting the chit out of them (your fragmented property theory). Or a combination of both?.

We’ve got a group of FL guys just down the highway from us and they manage and don’t shoot crap, numbers wise, compared to the local rednecks that have 50 members hunting a 2500 lease across the creek from us, killing everything they see with brown hair 7 days a week and 24/7.

It cannot be analyzed, even on a county basis. It’s really what is happening in individual 2000- 5000 acre blocks all across the state that has to be looked at. We are covered up with deer by the way. As are all of our neighbors in our mgmt co-op. Why, because we’ve got the food and don’t have hardly any pressure, same with the FL guys down the road too. Locals only club complains they just aren’t killing any good bucks anymore and they’re deer are all nocturnal. Wonder why.

Both factors are at play at different levels in different areas……Out of state hunters dont impact every county evenly

Speaking for the Wilcox, Dallas, and Marengo county area, I’d much rather have the FL and GA out of staters surrounding me, than I would locals. My experiences with out of staters hunting this three county area are that they normally follow all game regs, are involved in fairly large acreage, well managed, low pressure leases, and are fairly selective about what they shoot. My 30 yrs of experience in this area with the locals, unless they are large individual land owners, is the exact opposite. But like you say, it’s probably very area specific.

All that’s good and fine……I’ve been places where they shoot everything that moves…..that’s not really the point of what I said though……My statement is that if hunter density just went up in some of the southern counties then the likely didn’t come from the addition of resident hunters……Those extra hunters likely came from out of state…..Some of y’all sure love to try to make this about some kind of emotional response rather the accounting math that’s on the board….

There’s likely areas where little change is occurring……I think it might be a little naïve though if we just assume it wont impact someone because they may be one of the pretty big dogs in an area…….even 3-5K acres isnt really that much when you step back and look at the fact that the doe harvest for say Bullock Co just increased 43%.......Things like dilutions in water and deer don’t stay highly concentrated in one area when the levels get lower and lower around it……It has a way of spreading out……I think folks in Montgomery Co are about to find that out…..Folks where the bigger properties exist might see it get drawn down a little slower……If you look at the trend line for the county wide doe harvest though at its climbing to 40%, 50%, 60% more all around me......that would be something I’d be interested in understanding why…….Because when you start looking around one day wondering why the population isnt as high as it used to be……there will be your likely answer.

Why is it likely that an increase in hunters comes from out of state?

Where would a bunch of new resident hunters come from?.....Is it more likely that the additional hunters came from an Alabama resident who has never deer hunted before suddenly taking up the sport or from the Florida hunting club taking on more members from Tampa to pay for the lease?.......This is actually something that we don’t have to even guess about……the state knows how many out of state licenses they are selling…..If it has increased, then that increased hunter density is impacting certain counties more than others……

I wish Louisiana would limit the number of people able to fish and duck hunt from of out of state. That would leave more ducks, geese and fish for me. I’m sure some residents in Florida want limits on out of state people fishing and turkey hunting. Hell Kansas, Illinois, Nebraska, Missouri, Indiana, and Texas residents probably want less out of state hunters also. Careful what you ask for.

How many of these out of the way areas have businesses dependent on hunters. Thai affects much more than deer numbers

Case in point

The bio from Louisiana stated that the same numbers of ducks are being killed annually
The average kills per hunter is down along with hunter satisfaction, but from a biological standpoint it’s all the same when management decisions are made

That being said I kinda get where you come from CNC. I’ve been promoting lower lints and less time afield with ducks and turkeys so I get it. I also get I could be completely wrong asking someone else. Everybody’s perspective is different

If I'm conceding to giving up a buck tag and going from 3 to 2.....I would want to know that the state is t going to just keep selling more tags to out of state hunters and get the same amount of deer shot anyways.....I'm not giving that buck tag up just for them to sell it to an out of state hunter

I would bet you that the state of Alabama would rather sell me a $463 license before they’d want to sell a resident a license for $15 or whatever it costs a resident to hunt. I’m just a dumb coonass but I know which is more valuable to the powers to be.

Simple economics

Yep and that continual increase in out of state license cost, combined with the outrageous inflation on everything else is already lowering the number of out of state hunters traveling to AL to lease land and hunt. Chuckie and the powers that be, are quietly and slowly killing that golden goose which, in the grand scheme of things isn’t going save a single deer. The harvest void created by limiting the out of state hunters will be more than filled by the game hog locals just killing more deer. Here’s the math of it: one out of state license sale is equal in revenue to essentially 30 in state license sales. Let’s say there are 210,000 in state licenses sold @ $15; that’s $3.15 million in revenue. Now let’s say there are 20,000 out of state licenses sold @$400; that’s $8 million in revenue. This disparity doesn’t even account for guys like me with a lifetime license I purchased 25 yrs ago that they are getting no license revenue from anymore. If the state is smart and really cares about the wildlife, and we have the major problems youre suggesting and hypothecating that we already have, seems like the best way to improve hunting and health of the wildlife in the state would be to limit the in state license sales to just landowners with a minimum acreage of X amount only, thus limiting the impact of largest pool of hunters while promoting increasing the number of out of state hunters which are the smallest pool by a factor of 10x, to maximize the money coming into AG&F for enforcement and wildlife mgmt and minimize the animals harvested. Be very careful what you wish for CNC. If I know the state of AL and the way the Chuckie views things, they’ve already done this math. And this little math lesson doesn’t even begin to account for the economic impact on towns and cities and local businesses of the out of state hunters versus in state hunters, which is astronomically higher, by a factor of 100X to 200X than the license revenue disparity. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ is what drives the wildlife mgmt goals in AL and don’t ever forget that.

Without data to support your theory it's nothing more than an opinion.

Baiting Privilege License: Costs $18.05 for residents and $61.85 for non-residents.

Nighttime Feral Swine & Coyote License: Costs $17.60 for residents and $60.15 for non-residents.

i don't really understand WMA fees either .

why the state permit fee for ducks or for trapping ?

and the fact it was said people over 65 are free loaders don't help their case .those are just off the top of my head . im sure theres some fishing permits that all about money too .

Anyone with a half of a brain knows how works. If have a product that people that people are will to pay top dollar for, you market that product to attract the top dollar spenders. Don’t get me wrong, we could slaughter the deer on our place according to state rules but we’d be only hurting ourselves. Our neighbor tells us stories of the old club that had the place and the slaughter they used to have. By December there wouldn’t be a deer to be seen on the place. Anyway if the state of Alabama would cut the limit to 2 bucks and let’s say 4 does, it wouldn’t bother us because our self imposed limit is 3 bucks and only 2 does per person. A 2 buck limit would be fine. But that limit does not sell as good as 2 deer a day and a doe a day for the whole season. I believe setting a limit that low for the price of an OOS license would lose and lot of hunters causing a big decrease in money in the politicians pockets and for wildlife conservation.

The number of license sales is a driving factor for how much each state receives from the Pittman Robertson money. Lifetime licenses are still counted in this annul funding. It looks complicated, for sure, but that funding has to be spent correctly as explained in the link above.

Unless something changes with the federal funding mechanism, there will never be a time when wildlife agencies will try to limit license sales. Why do you think you have to buy a WMA license before you can register for a SOA hunt? License sales.....