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Key:
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Global Mod,
Mod
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Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 233
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 233 |
This could be great but who will they get to buy the pulpwood once everything has been cut and replanted? They can’t sale the pulpwood they have now even if it’s got the green light from the nepa
Job 12:7-9
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 10,173
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 10,173 |
Maybe pine will be worth more soon. It sucks now at least for the landowners
Two roads diverged in the woods and I took the one with deep ruts,hills and mud.It may be bumpy but WHAT A RIDE!
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 19,302
Old Mossy Horns
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Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 19,302 |
Imagine affordable plywood again. Just imagine. Ain’t that the truth. I went to buy a sheet of 1/4” last week and after seeing the price said to heck with that.
If voting made any difference, they wouldn’t let us do it.-Mark Twain
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797 |
And quality , pressure treated lumber that will last. That’s 100% chemical related and 100% EPA related. Same reason everyone has termite issues now. Watered down chemicals and treatment processes that actually worked, all the way to the point that you may as well just be pissing on either one and calling it treated.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,517
Pope of Aldeer and Expert
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Pope of Aldeer and Expert
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,517 |
With my chemically balanced brain I'd like smart folks to pass a regulation that it's okay for you to oppose logging but your group has to fund a homeless shelter to accommodate 50 beds and provide job training and life skills for those men. I'm not chainsaw trained but I know how to play with fire. And if I know Cali burns every year because the government won't let you log and reduce the fuel load for those fires those California politicians got to be reallllyyy dumb.
Skinny is my EX.Alcohol was involved.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813 |
Canadian lumber is a better product than southern pine lumber. I hate it but it’s a fact Care to explain?
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 976
6 point
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6 point
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 976 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797 |
The way I’ve heard it explained is that the slow growth timber is denser than farmed timber using genetically modified seedlings to maximize growth and shorten the time between planting and harvest ability. Growth rings on slow growth timber will be narrow and much tighter. Growth rings on most of the “ super Pines” being planted and grown in the SE are typically 2-3 times as wide as the slow growth rings, because the SE pine it is growing two to three times as fast, by design.
It also doesn’t help that almost all of our really high graded wood leaves the US to be sold overseas at much higher prices.
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,496
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,496 |
I don’t think the mills in the south have had production handcuffs from environmental factors in recent years - just filling the housing markets as needed with ebbs and flows.
I don't think so either, and the end result of this is likely even lower prices for timber in our area. The crazies in the NW had rather their timber to rot than allow it to be cut. If that changes, ours is gonna be worth even less. That doesn't mean I'm against letting them cut their timber; just saying it will probably not be good for us in Alabama.
All the labor of man is for his mouth, and yet the appetite is not filled.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion Actually Spruce is the less dense of the 3 major softwoods sold and the majority of it does come from Canada. Southern yellow pine has a higher resin content making it more weather resistant, heavier, and better for load bearing applications. Spruce will snap long before yellow pine. That's why you see trusses and structural posts made from yellow pine and not spruce. Spruce is absolutely cheaper though. Fir does combine the best of both worlds and falls in between the other 2 as it is lighter than spruce but not quite as strong as yellow pine. I sell lumber for a living. You can probably guess as to what kind. As to price, the problem isn't with the lack of harvest, the problem is the mills.
Last edited by Driveby; 03/03/25 09:17 AM.
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 3,768
8 Point
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8 Point
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 3,768 |
So what regulations were stopped? Just a guess on my part , but I'd say a couple would be opening up Federal lands to logging and relaxing regs on chemicals and EPA in manufacturing of timber products. I sure hope the federal lands isn't the case. It worries me that we will start seeing national forests logged. If you want to own a pine plantation, that's fine. Public land shouldn't be touched. I'm a Trump supporter, but some of the environmental stuff is worrisome. National forest are in terrible need of proper timber management, including some harvest. Inactive or passive management is not management at all, and does not help wildlife or the public. As with anything, it should be closely monitored and regulated, but not logging public lands in the south is a huge mistake IMO. Anyone who thinks public lands dont need timber management just go to Bankhead and look at what the pine beetles have done.
Its not the will to win but the will to prepare to win!
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion Actually Spruce is the less dense of the 3 major softwoods sold and the majority of it does come from Canada. Southern yellow pine has a higher resin content making it more weather resistant, heavier, and better for load bearing applications. Spruce will snap long before yellow pine. That's why you see trusses and structural posts made from yellow pine and not spruce. Spruce is absolutely cheaper though. Fir does combine the best of both worlds and falls in between the other 2 as it is lighter than spruce but not quite as strong as yellow pine. I sell lumber for a living. You can probably guess as to what kind. As to price, the problem isn't with the lack of harvest, the problem is the mills. Weren't a bunch of the mills in the SE purchased by a Canadian conglomerate over the past 7-10 yrs?
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,873
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,873 |
I don’t think the mills in the south have had production handcuffs from environmental factors in recent years - just filling the housing markets as needed with ebbs and flows.
I don't think so either, and the end result of this is likely even lower prices for timber in our area. The crazies in the NW had rather their timber to rot than allow it to be cut. If that changes, ours is gonna be worth even less. That doesn't mean I'm against letting them cut their timber; just saying it will probably not be good for us in Alabama. You guys get it but I hope we’re wrong . Most regulations for logging exist at fed level pertaining to gov lands . Some states out west loggers have apply for permit 6 months in advance with a detail description of how a when they gonna log a job they bid on a put up lot money to just bid . And pay a bond the gov holds u til job is done to there liking . It will open up a lot of land to loggers and flood the markets even more . In southeast there is a glut of pine lumber on the market because we produce so much . Prices should reflect that but they don’t . We sell pulp,cns an sawlogs at cheapest price in long time . The wholesale lumber buyers is gouging the home improvement stores an have been since Covid . Finding a market for pine sawlogs is hard to do even at cheap prices . Here in Alabama we have less regulation for loggers than almost any state . Forest production is huge industry here .best thing tariffs might do stop Canadian lumber coming here . Most lumber in northeast states come from Canada when there is a glut here .
Brushwacker
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Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,155
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,155 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion Actually Spruce is the less dense of the 3 major softwoods sold and the majority of it does come from Canada. Southern yellow pine has a higher resin content making it more weather resistant, heavier, and better for load bearing applications. Spruce will snap long before yellow pine. That's why you see trusses and structural posts made from yellow pine and not spruce. Spruce is absolutely cheaper though. Fir does combine the best of both worlds and falls in between the other 2 as it is lighter than spruce but not quite as strong as yellow pine. I sell lumber for a living. You can probably guess as to what kind. As to price, the problem isn't with the lack of harvest, the problem is the mills. Weren't a bunch of the mills in the SE purchased by a Canadian conglomerate over the past 7-10 yrs? I know of a few in SC are run by CanFor. There’s a few mills run by American companies still around but thinking CanFor has the bulk of them here.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 11,813 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion Actually Spruce is the less dense of the 3 major softwoods sold and the majority of it does come from Canada. Southern yellow pine has a higher resin content making it more weather resistant, heavier, and better for load bearing applications. Spruce will snap long before yellow pine. That's why you see trusses and structural posts made from yellow pine and not spruce. Spruce is absolutely cheaper though. Fir does combine the best of both worlds and falls in between the other 2 as it is lighter than spruce but not quite as strong as yellow pine. I sell lumber for a living. You can probably guess as to what kind. As to price, the problem isn't with the lack of harvest, the problem is the mills. Weren't a bunch of the mills in the SE purchased by a Canadian conglomerate over the past 7-10 yrs? Yes, a whole lot of them.
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,219
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,219 |
And quality , pressure treated lumber that will last. They won't let this happen. Gotta rot, buy, and replace every so often in order for the lumber industry to remain profitable.
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 976
6 point
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6 point
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 976 |
Here we go….Tariffs have hit and lumber market is climbing stores are prob raising prices as we speak!
Last edited by Gobl4me; 03/04/25 06:43 AM.
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,670
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,670 |
Here we go….Tariffs have hit and lumber market is climbing stores are prob raising prices as we speak! I'd suspect it might be a price increase and they're using DJTs tariffs as an excuse.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,797 |
Canadian spruce vs southern pine
Spruce is stronger. More weather resistant. And more likely to start straight and stay straight when framing.
Southern pine could be close competition if the long leafs and mixed stands were used for lumber instead of commercial quick grown loblolly.
My opinion Actually Spruce is the less dense of the 3 major softwoods sold and the majority of it does come from Canada. Southern yellow pine has a higher resin content making it more weather resistant, heavier, and better for load bearing applications. Spruce will snap long before yellow pine. That's why you see trusses and structural posts made from yellow pine and not spruce. Spruce is absolutely cheaper though. Fir does combine the best of both worlds and falls in between the other 2 as it is lighter than spruce but not quite as strong as yellow pine. I sell lumber for a living. You can probably guess as to what kind. As to price, the problem isn't with the lack of harvest, the problem is the mills. Weren't a bunch of the mills in the SE purchased by a Canadian conglomerate over the past 7-10 yrs? Yes, a whole lot of them. Well there is the answer on why the landowners selling the timber and people buying finished lumber are getting screwed. When 70-80% of the production capacity is owned by one group, they set the material input pricing and the finished product pricing.
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,900
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,900 |
Logging and good game management practices could be a win win. I know I found out the importance having a combination of browse and other food sources is better than huge tracts of just pines or oaks. An open canopy encourages browse growth.
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