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Zeiss
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Re: The 24 hour rule on check in
[Re: NightHunter]
#669886
09/06/13 05:06 AM
09/06/13 05:06 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 24,550
Awbarn, AL
CNC
Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 24,550
Awbarn, AL
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Are they shooting every deer in the state to get their data or are they taking a sample? How will they ever be able to make educated decisions with only a sample?
You still didn’t answer my question…..Can I take the average weight of the deer killed in District 4 and use it to tell me how many deer to kill on my hunting lease? What about trends in total deer killed in the district….does that help me manage my hunting lease? Does fawn recruitment for the district tell me anything about my hunting lease? Tell me which one of these state of district averages is going to manage my land for me?
I think it is obvious they are taking samples. That said, the sample size was significant enough and they saw clear evidence to make a decision on a relatively small area. As far as D-4 goes. If they had the data like they are wanting then yes you could make some determinations on what to do on your lease. They could pull the Barbour county #'s and give you a pretty fair representation of what is going on. The problem is all of you guys are looking at it at a site specific level and we are talking about at the landscape level. That is two totally different things. The biologists aren't going to take this data and give a paint brush approach management regime and then walk away and say "success, we've done it", they will still be there to make site specific recommendations. It just isn't that hard guys. It you don't agree with it, I get that but to not understand when we've laid it all out there multiple time, I just don't get. They aren't saying they are trying to manage your specific lease with their data collection. You know as well as I do there are clubs that manage and clubs that are still "brown it's down." Putting a measurement on that is important to the big picture. Here's the problem with the way you are looking at it NH. You are trying to manage deer on a landscape level and deer herds exist on a site specific level. When I took over my own lease I only moved 4 miles down the road. Our rut on the new land occurs at least 2-3 weeks ahead of the other land. The deer population is at least 25% greater than on the other property. The new land is absent of many indicator plant species such as beggar lice or pokeweed while they were much more readily available on the old land. What about the management area in another part of the county. Do you think conditions are the same there. You see my point. You are not really trying to manage the deer. You are simply attempting to manage your neighbors and in doing so you are willing to sell out on any principles to do so. You said so in your last paragraph.
Last edited by CNC; 09/06/13 05:07 AM.
We dont rent pigs
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Re: The 24 hour rule on check in
[Re: NightHunter]
#669889
09/06/13 05:06 AM
09/06/13 05:06 AM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Warrior River Country
49er
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Warrior River Country
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They will not be required to do anything. If they don't allow hunting, then hunting regs. will not apply. Should not be an issue. If the sex ratios and buck age structure are out of balance there and the habitat is suffering due to the lack of proper manipulation of the population, does the state not have a duty to manipulate the population there for "the good of the herd" regardless of the wishes of those who have a responsibility for managing the land? I'm not following your reasoning. Is the presence of hunting the sole determining factor of the states duty to see that the "good of the herd" is protected? Why don't you point out the laws that make it a duty for our state to implement mandatory wildlife management practices on privately owned lands so we can look at them together and get a better understanding of the difference in the two tracts of land I used as an example.
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Re: The 24 hour rule on check in
[Re: YEKRUT]
#669921
09/06/13 05:23 AM
09/06/13 05:23 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 24,550
Awbarn, AL
CNC
Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 24,550
Awbarn, AL
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Night Hunter, I agree that neighbors can sometimes be a pain but if you want to manage everyone’s neighbor then the way to do it is through education. Does that mean that you are going to hand your neighbors a pamphlet or invite them to a seminar and next year all your problems will be solved. No. There will likely be many who never change and their mentality will be one, that for lack of a better term, just has to die out. On the other hand, in the process of trying to educate them, there will be many who will pick up that pamphlet or attend that seminar and change the mentality of the next generation. Education will take much longer and will not be the immediate solution to your neighbor problems like we perceive regulations will be. However, it’s a much better long term solution that doesn’t trade the freedoms of all hunters in the state to satisfy your need for immediate change. We may not see everyones neighbors change their mentality through education (instead of regulation) but our kids and grandkids may very well……and if we choose that route instead of the one were on now, they may very well still be able to do a camera survey without getting a permit from the state
Last edited by CNC; 09/06/13 05:25 AM.
We dont rent pigs
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Re: The 24 hour rule on check in
[Re: YEKRUT]
#670316
09/06/13 11:05 AM
09/06/13 11:05 AM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494
Jefferson
Fun4all
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494
Jefferson
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Okay, I can no longer read the continual avoidance of one issue that does not seem to be addressed in this thread. Why is anyone advocating for or in agreement with a FORCED COMPLIANCE under penalty of law to gather this information??????????????
It is a SIMPLE thing to make the reporting VOLUNTARY, is it not?
I will not disagree that data is good, but I will disagree when collecting that data becomes a criminal act for non-compliance!!!!
Nighthunter, give us a reason WHY the data collection requires a penalty for non-compliance.
Last edited by Fun4all; 09/06/13 11:05 AM.
"After all, it is not the killing that brings satisfaction; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport." Dr. Saxton Pope
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