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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: Vulkanman]
#744511
11/14/13 11:42 AM
11/14/13 11:42 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209 Chelsea, AL
straycat
OP
Old Mossy Horns
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OP
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209
Chelsea, AL
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Where is the chapter about dividing the covenant? I'd start with the entire Book of Hebrews. Then look at: Jeremiah 31 Luke 22 1 Corinthians 11 2 Corinthians 3 Hebrews 8, 9, 12 specifically
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#744573
11/14/13 12:38 PM
11/14/13 12:38 PM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670 NW Alabama
R_H_Clark
Leupold Pro Staff
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Leupold Pro Staff
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670
NW Alabama
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While I will agree that I will never know all things about God, I do not like to take the attitude that whatever happens is because God wanted it to happen and he had some grand purpose in it that I just can't understand.
I do know God's will in many areas simply because he has told me in his word. Some things happen because we live in a fallen world and men have free will and make bad choices.
I do believe that God will try to bring about good from any bad situation but that doesn't mean that he orchestrated things so that the bad situation would happen. I don't think that God wants evil to happen, for people to sin or for bad things to happen. He does love us greatly after all. But I know that he allows evil to exist...he allows people to sin...he allows bad things to happen. The All Knowing, all Mighty, All Powerful, Ever Present nature of God tells me he could stop whatever he wanted to stop. He is Sovereign! He Is Purposeful and Perfect! But these things still occur. Many get hung up on this and try to figure it out. I spent a number of years approaching it like that. This is where deep Bible study will reveal to us what we NEED to know about the nature of God, His covenants, and many of His purposes. We will gain understanding, gain wisdom, gain insight that we can apply to our lives and impart to others. But we cannot know in entirety. 1 Corinthians 13:12 12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known. So I have to let go of my own marginal understanding (lean not) and just trust God. Trust Him in His promises. I know that God allows evil but I believe it is only because we allow evil. God has given us dominion of this world for good or evil until he takes control of it again. At that time there will be no evil, sickness or pain. The earth is the Lord's but he has given it to us until the appointed time. God's will is done but he works through men and has men to declare his will into the earth.
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#744624
11/14/13 01:30 PM
11/14/13 01:30 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209 Chelsea, AL
straycat
OP
Old Mossy Horns
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OP
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209
Chelsea, AL
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We agree on 99% of most theology I'd suspect. But....I would say there is much more to it than that.
Satan is real (which I'm sure you agree) and he has been allowed to have some level of rule or power here on the earth and in the spiritual world too. There is a spiritual battle being waged and there is real legitimate evil happening as a result. He is called the prince of darkness, god of darkness (little g), hurls flaming darts, and prowls like a lion--in Scripture. I'm not saying how much rule or power he has because I don't know for sure. I just know I'm to look out. The reason I say this is based on Scripture...The result of Adam's sin is a fallen world where sin and evil abounds and where Satan has deceiving power. We are warned repeatedly to guard our hearts and to flee from evil.
Job...God allowed Satan to try to make Job fold. Satan was allowed to do those things here on earth.
The Gospels tell us of Satan tempting Christ. So bold to tempt the Lord.
Satan is said to be the deceiver of the whole world in Revelation 12:9..shows his power and ability.
Satan is told to have deceiving quantities to blind the minds of men from the Truth. 2 Corinthians 4:4 4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.
Ephesians 6: 10-20 tells us more about the spiritual warfare going on between the devil and us. We are to arm ourselves and to put on armor--defensive weapons and offensive weapons are called for in this passage. Weapons of war.
We are told to watchout and keep our minds in tune to God 1 Peter 5: 8-10 8 Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. 9 Resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same kinds of suffering are being experienced by your brotherhood throughout the world. 10 And after you have suffered a little while, the God of all grace, who has called you to his eternal glory in Christ, will himself restore, confirm, strengthen, and establish you.
Now I know we agree that Satan is deceived himself and the Lord will reign because all dominion is his. But I would say based on Scripture that at the heart of all sin and all the bad choices we as mankind make lies the Father of Lies--Satan. It isn't us men that allow evil to exist...it is evil that exists because of the fall that deceives us into allowing evil to take root, to manifest, to hold us captive, to separate us from God and Christ. This is the battle Satan is waging against us. This is the battle between good and evil as told in Genesis 3:15...enmity between Satan and mankind.
Now God is Sovereign and will work it all out. But we are tasked with a priority assignment in the meantime:
James 4: 7-10 7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. 8 Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Be wretched and mourn and weep. Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will exalt you.
Last edited by straycat; 11/14/13 01:31 PM.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: R_H_Clark]
#744799
11/14/13 03:43 PM
11/14/13 03:43 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,545 Marshall County
FurFlyin
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,545
Marshall County
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Brother, I don't see much to disagree with there. I know Satan is the source of evil but he was only allowed into authority by Adam's obedience to him. Satan has no power or authority over or in any believers life unless we give him access.
We could have a discussion about Job one day that might be interesting. I believe I could show you how Job allowed Satan into his life and how all God did in that situation was speak the truth. God did not hand Job over to Satan. Have at it, I'll be tuned in and watching for that one. I look forward to it.
If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: Bigbamaboy]
#744824
11/14/13 03:52 PM
11/14/13 03:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 6,101 alex city
oakachoy
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 6,101
alex city
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I recently taught a lesson dealing with this issue. The answer is really simple. However, you must know and understand the Word of God to comprehend this answer. 1) For the glory of God. John11:4 2) So that unbelievers may believe. John 11:15 3) So that we may have a testimony. John 9:4 4) To increase/ purify the faith of believers. 1 Peter 1:6-7, James 1:2-4
GOD LOVES US!
BTW, Straycat, I really enjoy your Biblical post. I also appreciate that you back your statements with scripture instead of just spouting opinions. The Word is the only truth and every statement must be measured by it. I agree, I also believe he is a true soul. I need hearing reminders to be a better man.
WM Hunter "Trump literally sacrificed himself, his family and all of his businesses for this country. He literally is a true American hero. And True American Patriot - warts and all."
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#744840
11/14/13 03:59 PM
11/14/13 03:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,517 Land of the free because of th...
mike35549
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,517
Land of the free because of th...
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So when some child is killed in a car wreck that is just gods will, and god just allows this happen so some good is suppose to come of it. It is impossible for me to wrap my head around that and if it is true I can tell you I don't think it works. I personally believe that bad stuff just happens to good people and bad people. I do enjoy reading your posts.
If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: mike35549]
#745065
11/14/13 06:01 PM
11/14/13 06:01 PM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670 NW Alabama
R_H_Clark
Leupold Pro Staff
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Leupold Pro Staff
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670
NW Alabama
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So when some child is killed in a car wreck that is just gods will, and god just allows this happen so some good is suppose to come of it. It is impossible for me to wrap my head around that and if it is true I can tell you I don't think it works. I personally believe that bad stuff just happens to good people and bad people. I do enjoy reading your posts. I don't think bad things happen because it is God's will. I think they happen because we live in a fallen world.
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#745377
11/15/13 05:35 AM
11/15/13 05:35 AM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670 NW Alabama
R_H_Clark
Leupold Pro Staff
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Leupold Pro Staff
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,670
NW Alabama
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The House on the Rock
(Luke 6:46-49)
24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Notice that the storms came to both houses but the house founded upon the rock of Christ stood. That is not to say that as believers we aren't in a better position to keep the storms of life away. We can release our faith for divine protection and charge our angles to work for and protect us. We can keep ourselves from sin which will open the door for destruction in out lives. We can pray and listen to the Holy Spirit who will warn us of disaster to come.
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#745384
11/15/13 05:40 AM
11/15/13 05:40 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209 Chelsea, AL
straycat
OP
Old Mossy Horns
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OP
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,209
Chelsea, AL
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Parables are powerful teaching tools. Imagery combined with TRUTH.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#751014
11/19/13 05:16 PM
11/19/13 05:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 80 McCalla
Toxophilite
spike
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spike
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 80
McCalla
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I travel and work in areas where the predominate theme is suffering. It's tough even as a christian with a biblical worldview to process much of it even after years of ministry in these areas. Many who aren’t Christ-followers wonder where God is to be found in this hurting world. Why he seems so distant. How do you reconcile His presence and sovereignty with the reality of suffering? Even those of us who are followers still struggle at times with doubt and are broken and alienated by its lies instead of being broken and brought near by truth. I believe an understanding of what took place on the cross can shed light here. The cross alone has the power to bring us to full intimacy with the Father. Jesus could have bypassed the pain and suffering of the cross but would have himself been alienated from the Father’s heart as well and left us broken and apart from God. But in allowing himself to be broken, he draws us into intimacy with himself and the Father.
So let’s take a fresh look at the cross and let its implications sink in. Let’s not avert our eyes but look straight at it. We will be undone by it and questions will force their way to the surface as we see the tragedy of it. Let’s linger with our questions. Don’t rush the grieving process of the “why.”
I was moved recently in reading a story from Night by Elie Wiesel. During the holocaust, he, along with the whole concentration camp he was in, was forced to watch the hanging of three fellow prisoners. Two were adults and the third was a boy. The adults died quickly but the boy, being much lighter, strangled for quiet some time on the gallows before he finally died. Elie was losing his faith as he watched the hanging, asking in a growing crescendo "WHERE IS GOD?" He was struggling with the “WHY” of it all. Elie came to a partially wrong conclusion at the time, that he had witnessed God dying on the gallows and that God must surely be dead. Let this poem I wrote not too long ago and the conclusion of it, be something that strengthens our faith rather than weakens it, as we see the answer to Elie's question, but through the eyes of faith and hope, not fatalistic despair.
-GOD WHERE ARE YOU-
What can you learn from a victim of rape Or a boy swinging wildly from the gallows of hate Where is your God Oh you derelict fool As children are slaughtered in the sanctity of school
I searched and I looked as the terror flew in I listened in the thunder and the mighty whirlwind. Some speak of his justice and his sovereignty too But I couldn’t see either from my dreadful view
I thought I might find him looking down from above With eyes full of sadness and surely with love But it seemed he was hiding or absent in deed At the moment my life had the most terrible of need
Although I had missed him in my desperate search As I gazed up to heaven and pursued him in church I found him at last, not at all where I thought And yet right in the midst of the places I sought
He was swinging from the gallows; he was hanging in a tree He was buried in the rubble of the tower’s debris Being sold as a slave and robbed of his rights Then pimped out to johns in the darkest of nights
He’s shot with a bullet and stabbed with the knife Abused alongside of a tormented wife He’s ripped from the womb and smothered with a bag He’s beaten in the streets with a man called a fag
He’s orphaned and starving and tossed to the side Violently raped as a child…. and he cried “You'll find me if you look at the least one of these In as much as it’s done, it's being done unto me.” Roger Patterson ©2013
One day suffering will be gone and the tables will be overturned on evil once and for all. Christ's incredible passion and intense love will rage a final war on evil and all of it's pain. Can't wait to ride out with him on that mission.....
-Roger
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Re: Why Does God Allow Bad Things to Happen?--A Biblical Perspective Discussion.
[Re: straycat]
#751504
11/20/13 07:26 AM
11/20/13 07:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 14,770 Hoover
Fattyfireplug
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 14,770
Hoover
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What kind of man would I be had I not experienced adversity in my life? What kind of Christian would I be?
I doubt it would be the kind of man I want my son to be.
When my wife and I find ourselves trying to protect him from everything we have to step back and realize he will be a better man for suffering the adversities he goes through. Big or small, doesn't matter, they all make him a better man and hopefully a better Christian.
I love my son enough to let him fail. God loves us all enough to let us fail.
Character is not developed in moments of temptation and trial. That is when it is intended to be used.
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